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Ep 44. Taking the life changing creative leap & celebrating hidden mothers with Artist Sarah Detweiler


I n the 44th episode of the Arts to Hearts podcast, our host Charuka Arora is joined in conversation by an incredible artist & her friend Sarah Detweiler who shares her story of taking the creative leap by following her instincts & on creating her most successful & celebrated body of work so far.

Sarah is an artist based in Philadelphia popular for her embroidered figurative oil paintings of the “Hidden Mothers’

Find Sarah on:
Instagram: @sd_artifacts
Website: https://www.sarahdetweiler.com/

Connect with Our Host at: @charukaarora
Keep In Touch With Us at @artstoheartsproject

TimestampSpeakerTranscript
00:00.00charukaaroraHey, you guys welcome back to the arts to heart podcast and this is your host charka and you can hear my dogs not inside. Okay I am so excited to be here. Back on the podcast and I have a lovely friend and an amazing artist with me today. We’ve been planning to record this podcast for a really long time so it truly feels amazing to be finally be able to record this episode and I’m sure that you love her as much as I do It’s truly truly a pleasure and it’s on my honor to have Sara deyt fileo on the podcast today welcome to the wadcar sara.
00:42.25SarahHi Charika Thank you. It’s my honor to be here.
00:47.52charukaaroraAh I’m sure I think I I do we even need an introduction for you because I feel like you know you.
00:54.26SarahUm, oh stop. Ah, you’re like my biggest cheerleader.
01:00.54charukaaroraAh I I truly am definitely you. You can’t be on top of the list this this episode and this recording was on my on my list I wanted to make sure that we do this and I’m so glad that we’re finally doing this.
01:17.80SarahUm, thank you? Um yes, ah my name is Sarah detweiler and I am um.
01:19.60charukaaroraBut okay, let’s say for the sake of formality would you want to introduce yourself and what you do.
01:35.75SarahAh, sometimes have a hard time explaining my art. Um, but I’m ah a figurative painting I would say but I also include embroidery techniques in most of my work.
01:36.61charukaaroraAnd then she.
01:47.77charukaaroraYes, amazing and I I’ve been a big big fan of your work I you know how much I love your work. That’s like I I absolutely love it and I know that a lot of people um would resonate with me. In this? um sorry like in the past I think we’ve known each other for past 1 and a half year maybe close to 2 now with the whole art queens and I’ve seen like I of course in the beginning. Also your work was amazing. But I’ve seen you build. Ah.
02:12.69SarahUm, yeah.
02:25.69charukaaroraBut of the most beautiful series that I have seen so far which is the hidden mother and and it it. It is truly such an amazing experience even as a viewer and I’m sure it must have been even even.
02:29.18SarahNo my goodness. Thank you.
02:43.49charukaaroraMore better for you when you were making these works and you’re still continuing on working that series I can spot the new piece in the background here right now. Okay, but before we get it? Yes, thank you, you showed me this 1 I remember seeing it on Instagram also.
02:51.42SarahSneak peek for you.
02:58.67SarahI did I think you might have been the first person I showed.
03:02.42charukaaroraYeah, oh my god is that like I am so excited for that privilege. Ah, okay, so before we get into all of those things I so many questions. Let’s let’s start from the stat because I really want to know how things started for you. Um, I know a lot of interviews that you’ve already done I don’t want us to repeat those parts which but yeah, but in general for someone who for where you’ve reached today. Let’s talk about how did you start? Did you think you wanted to be an artist.
03:25.58SarahUm, right.
03:39.65charukaaroraAlways.
03:39.94SarahI Yes I always knew that um I actually just yeah, no no doubts there. Um, and I don’t.
03:44.65charukaaroraSuch a strong. Yes.
03:57.30SarahRemember it ever being a question of whether or not that was okay that was just yeah, although let’s see I Just actually for for my series that I’m working on now for my next show which is very um. It’s based on a theme of nostalgia. Um I I rated my parents attic the other day and found that all these treasures that was a fifth so grateful to my parents that they saved all this Stuff. Um.
04:23.76charukaaroraUm, for 1
04:33.36SarahAnd I found a like a journal from my my third grade ah class I think that I found the page where I wrote that I wanted to be an artist and that was really cool.
04:37.18charukaaroraUm, wow.
04:45.30charukaaroraUm, oh my God Oh well.
04:50.28SarahAnd I showed my daughter who’s in in um, first grade now and she just like her eyes lit up and she’s like wow mom you knew she does yes, she wants to be an artist and a pet trainer.
04:56.30charukaaroraUm, oh Wow Does She also want to be an artist. Oh my God Oh oh she has quite similar dream to mine I think.
05:09.93SarahAh, ah yeah, ah so yeah, so oh yeah, well so yes I always I always knew I went to be an artist. Um, and I always did all of my um extracurricular time.
05:13.75charukaaroraI Always I still think I yeah go it.
05:29.70SarahUm, for the most part went to art related things. So.
05:33.19charukaaroraDid you have any creative influence in your life I mean I feel like um art being artist is not a very conventional thought and like I’m sure like when your daughter sees you today.
05:45.34SarahUm, right.
05:52.36charukaaroraIt’s not. It’s not something really strange for her. It’s not something that she’s not seen it’s It’s very. It’s a very obvious and very protective environment for her to think of something like this because she has a role model in front in informal view. Um, how did that.
06:04.88SarahBright.
06:10.22charukaaroraHow was that experience for you. Did you did you have someone that felt like that made this thought possible for you or you were just like you know this is like it was on your own.
06:20.55SarahUm I think um, but kind of both my um I think it’s it’s in my genes because um, my dad’s father was a a painter. Um.
06:36.81charukaaroraUm, oh wow.
06:39.97SarahAnd he also worked in in um, advertising um back when you know they didn’t use computers to do advertising and um and he painted portraits and landscapes and um so he did a lot of.
06:52.52charukaaroraUm, for well.
06:59.63SarahI was not I’m I’m back and that it’s not it wasn’t like a um, very close relationship but he did um, definitely influence me and teach me some things and I think he was the first person that taught me how to draw a portrait. So um, that kind of stuck with me and. Ah, yeah I had you know I think my my parents have always been my biggest supporters but that neither of them are artists so they didn’t know like it. You know.
07:26.47charukaaroraWell.
07:34.31SarahThey did a great job considering that they didn’t necessarily know how to kind of um ah help help a a young artist flourish but they they definitely made their efforts and and signed me up for extra classes and and. You know I would get a lot of art things I was allowed to paint in the basement where the rug they didn’t care if I got you know paint on it. You know things things like that.
08:00.70charukaaroraYeah, absolutely I know I’m sure I think they’ve done a great job with that because um I just feel like it itself being an art as a such. Ah it. It is a hard experience because a I think it’s also very very isolated. Um, practice in itself and then there’s also a lot of self- talking to infrow and all of that and I think if you if you get the support of your neo and your ones and if they are there. Um, it just makes the entire process So much better. Otherwise it’s.
08:20.65SarahYes.
08:37.30SarahUm, yeah, yes, um, but in in another sense. Ah, how do I put this.
08:38.65charukaaroraEven more lonelier than it already is a.
08:56.49SarahI didn’t have to like art wasn’t 1 of my ways to rebel because I had so much support. so so I rebelled in some you know some less safe ways. But um.
09:00.89charukaaroraOkay. Ah, yeah.
09:14.68SarahI will say that like art is such an excellent way to ah and safe way to rebel so ah and you have to do that You have to rebel in your life right? So in some ways. Um if anybody out there.
09:21.76charukaaroraYeah. Yes.
09:33.95SarahIs feeling like they don’t have this poor of their family then they can look at it as like their you know their rebellion.
09:37.62charukaaroraYeah, yes, and I think even um, yeah I think a lot of us as artists use art as a rebellion like it’s a sudden rebellion in some ways and it then it grows from there and but I think what’s also at least.
09:49.40SarahYes.
09:56.66charukaaroraThat worked for me because I spent a lot of time alone growing up and art became like this this friend this escape this place of comfort that beat like that you create for yourself that just takes that.
10:12.16SarahAh.
10:16.46charukaaroraYou know this subconscious company is something that you can feel but it’s not there, but it is there so that it even when it’s lonely. It’s not lonely I remember when while I was growing up so I spent a lot of time in my room and I would just sit for hours and hours and not go out and.
10:19.81SarahYes, and.
10:35.88charukaaroraMy mom would be dearly like she would be so um, astonished that how can I spend like every everybody in my family would be so astonished that how can I spend so many hours in a room closed and just you know just that and for me.
10:47.45SarahIs this this.
10:53.22charukaaroraTo me. It never felt unusual because I never felt that I was alone at that point. In fact, I feel like I felt more lulier when I was amongst a lot of people instead I felt so much better So much better when I’m I was making that.
11:03.62SarahAh, so get that.
11:12.25charukaaroraI Whatever I was making and I think what what is even amazing is when we start off and this is a recent conversation that I’ve also had with I know Laura I had Laura on the podcast so we had such a lovely conversation about these things and like how when we begin. Um. Ah, practice is soon So So naive. But so fresh like it is so us. But once you get into it. It. It’s so hard to keep that that that freshness that you know that experimentalism that.
11:47.15SarahYes.
11:50.23charukaaroraThat child alive especially when you try to Pursue Creative Arts or visual. Whatever you’re doing as a profession have you had have you had any feelings like that.
11:56.73SarahUm, yeah.
12:03.60SarahUm, like art. Do you mean recently? or ah ah I mean yeah I don’t know if any artist can escape that I like to meet the.
12:08.77charukaaroraAnyway, any of in your journey so far.
12:20.58charukaaroraUm, that.
12:22.10SarahThem if they have but um, yeah I mean I also have a background in art therapy. So I also I also hear that in a different way too because I’ve worked you know in the past
12:28.97charukaaroraA vow.
12:40.71SarahKnowing the the power of art and knowing how there is that certain point in childhood that um, the artists continue on and and other children don’t continue on and then they feel like they they remove that title.
12:42.12charukaaroraHas.
12:58.54charukaaroraUm, yeah is an aunt.
12:59.27SarahYou know you know how they say every every child if you ask them if they’re an artist will tell that you they’re an artist. Um and just like getting to work with an ah adults in um, in the psychiatric setting and trying to help them find that child artist within them again.
13:17.50charukaaroraUm, and.
13:19.10SarahUm, and so that’s like that’s a really beautiful thing and um, but I definitely think that Yes, ah in the professional, um, artist’s life. You do still get caught up in in that.
13:21.98charukaaroraUm, mena.
13:37.12charukaaroraYeah.
13:38.63Sarahand and I feel that you know because art therapy is what I was doing um before I became a mom and you know that’s when I really pushed my fine art career forward because I was a stay at home Mom and I was able to do that. Um.
13:46.50charukaaroraOh rock.
13:58.49SarahBut I feel like ah in art therapy. There was my art was so much more about process and there was a lot of play involved and you know I miss that sometimes because I don’t I don’t have time to do that.
14:05.30charukaaroraUm, yeah, yeah, yeah.
14:17.44SarahI Can do it with my children but I feel like anytime I’m doing my art making it has to be. It’s like I’m working towards a show or something where it has to be focused on that I don’t know if that answered the question but.
14:22.51charukaaroraYeah, yeah, you know it perfectly makes sense and I think it’s it’s so strange that we will um as we feel we are moving forward. We also forget that we are giving. So much we in this process that we need to make sure that we’re reinventing like re-ading it intentionally into a light which is I remember when I first started um, getting back into the arts. It was I used to have so much fun because it never was for anything. It was just for myself. Because I was either making for you know an hour a day or 2 hours a day and it was just like I wanted to escape from something and some it just brought me joy I didn’t think was it good was it bad is it fitting my style is it fitting my series will someone like it. How will I share it.
15:13.27SarahRight.
15:18.82charukaaroraLike like or is does this fit my theme or does it fit my color palette or whatever we keep our ourselves into and I think now it’s so so hard to to you know, keep those voices siren even if I’m like. Even if it’s for a few minutes
15:38.16SarahRight now I know you’re you’re so right and it probably would add to my art practice if I even just took out ten fifteen minutes before I got into.
15:41.52charukaaroraUm.
15:53.54charukaaroraYeah, yeah, okay, but we can’t wait to see that. Okay, but let’s get back into your work.
15:56.60SarahAh, serious work you know and just did a little play. Um, so yeah, maybe I’ll try that out with.
16:13.50charukaaroraLet’s click. Let’s can you talk a little bit about first. Let’s talk about the major brought theme of what kind of work. Do you make and what really influences you and then we’ll of course go into the hairing mothers.
16:28.17SarahUm, okay, um I Guess if I were to describe ah my work to somebody that was not familiar with it. Um. I would say that I’ve always um I’ve always worked mostly in portraiture and um, figurative narratives. Um, and. These days. It’s mostly on portraiture. But it’s um, kind of expanding the idea of what a portrait is um, not the traditional portrait and um the as far as.
17:12.40charukaaroraUm, yeah.
17:23.10SarahProcess goes I um I include you know hand embroidery techniques into my work. Um, and that is ultimately it’s because it brings me joy and and that I love. I love to have both processes in my practice. Um, and it also allows me to play with I love to experiment with materials and I like to try new things.
17:43.66charukaaroraNow.
17:54.82charukaaroraUm, yeah. Um, are yeah.
18:01.59SarahSo It allows me, you know, um and I like to explore textures and levels of the surface as Well. So Um I would say that. Primarily I work in oil. That’s my preferred medium but it depends I’ll use whatever I need to make what it is happen.
18:30.35charukaaroraYeah, that’s that’s such a nice statement. Okay, um, in the last year you’ve developed body work called hidden hidden mothers that has in that has really really um.
18:42.76SarahAnd it’s.
18:50.26charukaaroraI Think added a lot more dimension to your work and your identity as an artist you um, do you want to talk about how that series series started for you and why Hiddenian mothers.
19:03.76SarahI Yeah so I always try to figure out a new way to explain it to so not to bore people that I’ve heard ah my explanation but um I. Stumbled across the Victorian Hidden Mother Photographs. Um, and this was ah just for anybody that doesn’t know it’s when um.
19:25.40charukaaroraYeah.
19:38.88SarahWhen they photography was long exposure photography and and you had to sit still so it wouldn’t blur. Ah, children’s portraits there. A trend started where um, the mothers and I have to say too. It’s a probably wasn’t always the mother it I.
19:55.97charukaaroraIt could.
19:56.94SarahKnow that there’s been fathers or nannies also probably in the photos but um, predominantly it was probably the mothers would throw some sort of fabric over them to try to camouflage them into the scene.
20:12.17charukaaroraCome back.
20:16.90SarahAh I’m looking where you’re sitting right now Toruka and thinking you know I’m seeing like oh ok, um I wish everybody had the visual. Um.
20:25.24charukaaroraBut I I have ah I have a hidden I have a hidden child type that the 1 that you can’t see but I have yeah.
20:31.19SarahUm, yeah, know your dog. Um, yeah, so this just fascinated me because um, it’s like. You know and some in some of the the photographs it was more convincing I think like youre I kind of I think that’s a chair but I kind of see some hands maybe um and then there’s some that are just blatant. You know heads. Ghost ghostly looking um things holding these kids still for the photos. Um, and I actually didn’t start the series until I know was it a few years after I first. Notice that but I put it like I planted the seed I think I needed what’s that.
21:25.87charukaaroraIt’s yeah ready to how did you discuss stu. But how did you stumble upon this photographgraph. Um.
21:34.70SarahYeah, was like I I know I’ve I’ve been asked this before and I really wish I could remember the actual blog. There was some blog that I subscribe to that that just like um I Want to say like.
21:45.21charukaaroraOh well.
21:51.70SarahMental flaws or something like that where they would talk about you know, like random weird things.
21:53.14charukaaroraOkay, but it was totally random that was like no you want you weren’t just searching for something or you had and nothing it just out of the that happened.
22:01.70SarahNo wasn’t and I was just popped up in my email. Yeah and I always say I had like a very guttural response to it. Um, so I put it I played with the seed. But.
22:12.10charukaaroraUm.
22:19.48SarahThink I I needed to build up the confidence to actually explore it I think I wasn’t quite there yet where I don’t know I felt like what.
22:25.52charukaaroraWhat what time was this what stage of life for you in at this point.
22:31.37SarahI so I think I think I’ve I have done research since to try to find out when I first heard about it and I think it was around 2018
22:40.76charukaaroraUm.
22:47.38SarahSo I was already my daughter was already 3 I was already a mom which is I think probably a lot of why I I responded to it that way. So um I yeah kind of planted the seed and then I have to say and.
22:48.41charukaaroraYeah, yeah, yeah.
23:06.11SarahThis story actually is I feel like connected to your community and also um I don’t think I’ve ever told it um the first hidden mother which is actually owned by emily mullet who you know and you’ve done it.
23:20.97charukaaroraUm, shout guy Good Love us.
23:25.38SarahYeah, you so she has the original which is awesome. Um, if I did it for so I was accepted into ah an issue of create magazine. And the Jurors. What were um Sarah and Jason from paradigm and and with that that issue what came with getting with it’s all very connected. Ah.
23:43.44charukaaroraOh Wow. Okay I Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness I If I’m thinking I mean if this is what you’re going to say I’m blow. Go ahead.
24:00.92SarahOkay, so with with that um issue came a show everybody that got in that issue paradigm was having a show and it was um.
24:09.84charukaaroraUm, yeah I was 1 of the very early shows of create I feel.
24:18.70SarahI yeah I think while it was um, 2 thousand twenty yeah and it was their second. Yeah was from the pages to it was the second show that they did from an issue I think.
24:22.90charukaaroraUm I remember seeing pictures. Oh was it.
24:34.44charukaaroraUm, yeah.
24:37.67SarahAnd I had very different work in that issue. It was more yeah ah yeah, so ah so it was like figurative. It was about it was about my um, it was more narrative. Um.
24:41.61charukaaroraReally. Um, boys who love.
24:57.64SarahThere was more of like a landscape kind of in it but it had figurative. It had ah and it was about my um, kind of my fertility ah journey at the time and I remember I had to make a piece for the show.
25:00.30charukaaroraUm, yeah.
25:07.22charukaaroraYeah.
25:17.52SarahAnd I heard see here. It gets even more connected I was listening to 1 of cat of cats podcasts episodes. Um, at the time it was arts and cocktails. But now it’s the create podcast.
25:21.60charukaaroraA boy. Okay.
25:31.21charukaaroraYes, carried back.
25:34.40SarahOk, and she at the very bright moment I heard this episode where she talked about changing it up in your art and like kind of just going for it because I think that’s what she was doing in her practice and.
25:45.40charukaaroraUm, okay. Yeah.
25:53.42SarahI Remember thinking like I was like I kind of want to try something different but do I have to do something that was like what was in the issue is that what people are going to expect from me and there was that whole internal struggle of.
26:00.50charukaaroraUm, and yeah, yeah, yeah.
26:08.45SarahAnd and when I heard cat’s episode I was like I’m just going to go for it and that was my first hidden mother because that was what I wanted to explore and.
26:10.18charukaaroraAnd cool. Oh my goodness. Oh my I remember I remember seeing it like I had I think maybe I don’t remember but I remember you sharing the very first of your hidden mothers and I was following you by that time I don’t know what year that was but ah. I don’t I mean I surely remember that I’ve seen your first 2 now.
26:40.50SarahUm, yeah, well it hasn’t been that long to I think I it was 20 it was it was 20 It was the beginning of 2020 january of 2020 is when that show was I believe.
26:45.17charukaaroraUm, it could oh my god.
26:56.58charukaaroraReally that can’t know that can’t be possible because by Twenty Twenty week no because 2020 be everything was shot 2000 oh
26:58.45SarahYeah, no I know it’s creep. No I’m telling you it was January was the create show at Paradigm and then the following month or maybe it was March it was it was like beginning of March paradigm had their tenth anniversary show.
27:12.82charukaaroraUm, it’s yeah yeah.
27:22.67SarahAnd also so my second hidden mother was in that show and then that was the last time that we I was at an opening and then everything shut down. Ah so it’s crazy because I really haven’t been doing it for that long.
27:24.94charukaaroraUm, yeah, she that yes, you’re right? You’re right? Oh my right? Yeah but it does feel like you’re I mean you’re so good at it and it’s also become such. I mean of course we all as artists are evolving and our work keeps evolving and of course our work is a big extension of who you are, but for right now I feel like your hidden. My mothers have become such as such a signature of who you are also like the it’s it’s I do feel as a viewer. It’s become a very defining moment for you I don’t know if you feel that fear on. Did you think while you were making these works did you think they were like they become something that they’ve become today. They got so much. Love you I feel like.
28:06.61SarahYeah, oh oh, we absolutely without a doubt for me. Yeah.
28:23.39charukaaroraUm, with every work that you do, um it just I feel like you’re just pushing 1 1 boundary at a time and then it just keeps getting better and more final and like did you think that this series will become.
28:41.70SarahI had no clue even and I’ll tell I’ll tell you that I um for that for that first show I was just so excited exploring it and it was just making me so happy to.
28:42.20charukaaroraWhat it is today or if you were just.
29:01.58SarahSo I didn’t think about it and then um, when it sold out it was pretty shocking to me and.
29:03.53charukaaroraUm, nina.
29:13.61charukaaroraYeah, good and this was oh this was also online I Remember this wasn’t even the school the show you sold out wasn’t in person. Um, like yeah.
29:17.77SarahAnd then I um. Yeah, so you yeah I mean it it was hung in the gallery. But but so the space but no 1 Yeah yeah, I went in.
29:32.75charukaaroraYou were there. Yeah, he was allowed see I mean that’s even such a big deal.
29:40.10SarahI Know it’s crazy I Actually yeah I think um I Ah, it’s pretty crazy when I think about it.
29:45.56charukaaroraIt is It is.
29:51.81charukaaroraI. So okay, 1 more question so before the create show I know Paradigm has been such a pick a support of your work. You’ve worked with them. You can continually working with them. You did your solo shows now a question comes to my mind. That you’ve mentioned that they they were jury during the issue for create does that mean you did not like had you shown your work with them before were you familiar with them did you or was it via create that you. Actually became acquiinted.
30:30.84SarahUm, that’s a that’s a really good question so it wasn’t how we became acquainted I actually had been invited to I was in a show with them. But that was through um.
30:44.51charukaaroraNot s.
30:50.14SarahAh, on Instagram somehow um, because they were like I had my eye on them as a gallery I was like waiting until I felt ready and confident to approach them and Jason um chen who is 1 of the owners.
30:58.30charukaaroraUm, yeah.
31:05.74charukaaroraYeah, and.
31:07.25SarahThink he’s the 1 that started following me on Instagram and they um Paradigm has done this show. Um a bi coastal show with a gallery ah in Portland um, and so the the idea of the show is that they do um each artist.
31:20.70charukaaroraOkay.
31:26.84SarahThat they invite would do a piece for paradigm and a piece for it was antler gallery in Portland and that would those shows would be up at the same time and they would be related to each other and um I know that ah paradigm It’s kind of part of their mission also to support.
31:29.61charukaaroraUm, oh.
31:35.36charukaaroraUm, well.
31:46.20SarahAh, Philadelphia area artists. So I’m I’m assuming that that is part of the reason why I was invited to be in that show but I was doing something very different at that time and I so I wasn’t that what.
31:47.72charukaaroraUm, yeah.
31:55.37charukaaroraUm, okay, so but they had their eyes like let’s put it like way.
32:04.29SarahAh, maybe um, but it but I did that show with them. But then it was a couple of years before the create. so um so yes the ah the create show is definitely what put me.
32:10.58charukaaroraOkay.
32:22.81SarahOn their radar even more I think because um, it kind of like.
32:23.53charukaaroraYeah, and from there. Yeah from there did all of those things that you’ve been doing them with them. Can we say that that’s how it all happened because.
32:40.56SarahYeah, like.
32:40.97charukaaroraYou showed your first head didn’t work mother with them. Idly paradigm was the first place you showed your actual pace and then you’ve been showing you’ve shown all your hidden mothers with them. Oh my god.
32:51.14SarahYes, yeah, um, yeah because I I had the um, the first 1 at the create magazine show and that sold to my lovely emily.
33:05.73charukaaroraAround.
33:08.73SarahWho she was sneaky. She I didn’t know she bought it. Ah um, yeah I mean I I found out after the fact but um I heard it sold but I didn’t know it was her um and ah.
33:10.40charukaaroraOh Wow yeah.
33:25.51SarahThen I it just happened to be in their tenth anniversary show because they invited all the artists who had ever shown there to make a piece for it and that just happened to be a couple months after the create show and I made my second hit and mother for that and that 1 sold so that was ah.
33:39.17charukaaroraNo wow.
33:45.80SarahIt was after that that I was invited to um, be in a show with ah this 1 wasn’t a solo show is was like a featured collection show good kelly cosma and um han cow. Yeah.
33:55.66charukaaroraKelly kelly yeah, and then you did your solo show that’s sold online I think it it was not only all I don’t think it was even a few hours
34:03.44SarahSo yeah.
34:14.40SarahI Don’t think so I don’t know it was a few hours.
34:14.42charukaaroraWas it. Oh My God Oh My God How did that you.
34:22.33SarahAh, um, like it surreal. It still feels surreal. Oh look at your dogie cut. Sorry.
34:28.65charukaaroraUm, she’s it’s at 7 a m in the morning and she’s been here and that and she just she’s like just sleep. Okay I always she’s might be so far. Okay.
34:37.60SarahOh I Love her.
34:48.46charukaaroraSo let’s talk about what happened further once you did your high hit in Mothers I know that a lot of people that inspired you a lot of mothers that inspired you were eventually became a part of the series I know come and was a part of it I also know.
34:59.78SarahYes, yes yeah.
35:06.36charukaaroraDaniel. The jealous curator was a part of it and a lot of people I can’t remember more but I know a few more were a part of it. Um, how how has that interaction with people that you know and you’ve been including in in the series. How has that been.
35:27.14SarahUm, that was a really special experience. Ah it was ah it was like a gift that they gave me and I felt you know. Very like I had to handle it very you know, very carefully I I Respectfully it was It was so important for me to be authentic to their story and I really tried to make sure.
35:46.12charukaaroraOf my God yeah.
35:58.58charukaaroraYeah, because you’re beginning because you’re beginning pieces that remember were just you they had you in it and then you suddenly had more people being a part of the hidden mothers. He is.
36:07.48SarahYeah. Yeah, um, and I feel like whenever whenever I’m exploring a new direction. Well I say I’m starting to see this as a. Ah, pattern in my practice because I I don’t even like I’ve said before the hidden mother series is like the first time I’ve actually really had a series. Um, so.
36:37.98charukaaroraYeah, but this is this is even better because if you let’s say and even if this was your first drop or ah season. But I wouldn’t even say it like that because I feel like a lot of times we underestimate ourselves I think.
36:53.50SarahYeah.
36:55.82charukaaroraThis would be your first series that that has got so much attention and it does feel like that way. But I’m sure even if we if we look back in in the time that a lot a work that’s not got in so many eyes, but it’s still. It’s just I think a subconscious mind that.
36:58.75SarahRight.
37:14.33charukaaroraThat makes the more visible feel like mario.
37:18.10SarahThat’s true. Yeah, you’re right? but I definitely haven’t had as many pieces and you know I’ve had ideas for series. But I would always find that after doing the.
37:23.86charukaaroraUm, yeah.
37:33.98SarahThe third wine that I was just like I’m ready to move on but this 1 I didn’t feel that way I think it’s because I with this subject I can take it in so many different directions. Um, even that that was the cool thing about having the um.
37:35.59charukaaroraYeah.
37:44.53charukaaroraUm, yeah.
37:52.41SarahThe other mothers collaborate with me and let me tell their stories because it each each painting was so different.
38:00.64charukaaroraYeah, do ah they were gorgeous I feel like and they were the part of your solution tight. Yeah and you have another 1 and you have another coming work.
38:09.97SarahYeah, my last 1 Well oh yeah, that was the solo show. Yes, but I’m since I have a I just had a baby not long ago but I was I was smart.
38:21.92charukaaroraYeah.
38:27.50SarahI made it. It’s ah it’s gonna be in a year from now which is really cool because I’m like I’m I have the time I don’t have it. It’s not a ton of time for what I want to do but um.
38:28.86charukaaroraOh well. Yeah, you respond.
38:41.00charukaaroraSo.
38:42.96SarahI Do have a little more time to um, do that kind of that exploration part that I Love you know when you’re starting something new and and also I’m I am getting to ah consider this use of the space of the gallery.
38:49.40charukaaroraTape. Yeah yeah.
38:57.82charukaaroraUm, no, um, amazing and how has your own experience I know now that you’ve become a mother for the second time. Um, how has.
39:00.62SarahWhich is very exciting. Um, so.
39:13.87SarahYep.
39:15.72charukaaroraDo you feel like is that affecting your work now like your experience or how how do how would you explain that.
39:20.20SarahOh yeah, for sure. Um, um. So my I mean my the reason that I even went into the hidden mother series is because I ah my role as a mother and how I felt around it and um. My daughter Mia has always been a huge inspiration for me. Um, and she’s just kind of like my um, my little sidekick I call her my mini muse all the time. Ah. She’s she’s been there for so much of it. Even the I so I take a lot of my own reference photos and um, she’s and she’s helped me. She’s helped me with a lot of them. Um, but I remember because her bedroom.
40:14.62charukaaroraYeah.
40:24.44SarahFinally have a door on my studio but I didn’t have a door for a long time. Yeah, and so her and her her bedroom was um, kind of like she could see into my studio from her bedroom and she she would tell me like.
40:25.78charukaaroraReally. Wow.
40:38.12charukaaroraYou remind you only time.
40:42.99SarahMommy don’t because I would I would basically look like a ghost at the end of I me throwing sheets over me to take photos with a tripod and all that and she’d be like mommy. Don’t can you not can you stand there. Ah oh like oh sorry, but.
40:49.24charukaaroraUm.
41:02.42charukaaroraUm, oh my God I can completely think of the situation.
41:02.50SarahUm, it’s but it’s I Also I also do a lot of photos outside out front of my house and um.
41:13.98charukaaroraAnd.
41:17.19SarahBecause the day you know I want to get that that good daylight lighting for them and I always think of like cars driving by what what are they thinking? ah.
41:19.53charukaaroraUm, with they So ah, they feel like ah and I’m sure a lot of time people would have like anyone who’s just wo up from a sleep or like come from a nap or just going off for like in that state of mind and then they come out of the window and they see like.
41:38.73SarahUm, ah yeah, so.
41:38.79charukaaroraSomeone covered with a cloth and walking ghost. Ah, oh I what fun I should be a neighbor. Yeah yeah, really what did you do today.
41:46.28SarahYeah, right, it would be. It would be fun just look in my windows you should have seen me today. Oh my? yeah um, well my what my daughter was in school. Ah.
42:05.16charukaaroraYeah, yeah, yeah.
42:05.30SarahI Don’t want to give anything away because it’s going to be a painting for my new show. But let’s just say I Yeah I may have been in underwear and and dish gloves. Ah.
42:18.20charukaaroraAh, now I’m even more excited to see the painting and then you’ll have to come back then you’ll have to come back and then give us the whole thing.
42:20.62SarahYeah, and then ah absolutely sure. But yeah back to the the kids being an influence. So um, Mia. Actually will take full credit for my hidden mother series she as she actually does she says well, that’s it’s that they’re all about me. Ah, yeah, because she knows that you know I I tell her I’m like you’re the reason that I make the art that I do because you made me a mother.
42:44.54charukaaroraUm, really.
42:53.54charukaaroraUm, oh wow.
42:57.92SarahUm, yeah, so.
43:01.50charukaaroraSo does she like click these pictures with you and then like how involved is she in this process with you now.
43:08.78SarahUm, she actually will um brainstorm ideas with me and like sometimes they’re they’re really awesome actually and um I love her artwork so much so I actually am working on a um.
43:15.25charukaaroraUm, about.
43:28.57SarahAnd I actually put in in 1 of my um in my painting that’s the Hidden muse mother which was from my first hidden mother’s collection. Um I actually um, ah. There was a I’m wearing a um paint splattered ah piece of fabric and then I’m sitting in front of a chalkboard wall and there’s kind of like scribblings of chalk Marks. So I actually recreated her very first markings I have a.
43:48.10charukaaroraUm, yeah, yeah I am.
43:54.90charukaaroraUm, yeah.
44:04.19SarahAh, chalkboard wall in my studio that I always let her just draw on and her very first um markings I took a photo of and that’s what I recreated in the background of that painting and I’m actually working on a painting for this next series that actually I’m gonna be.
44:05.60charukaaroraUm, a vows.
44:21.60SarahIncorporating some of her drawings in again. So she loves it? Yeah oh yeah, absolutely here.
44:22.34charukaaroraOh now I How does she feel about that. She’s already an artist now and then such too young. Um I’m sure it must be so Um. So opening for her as a child also to to be taken Seriously I think a lot of us struggle with this even even now and I think that’s 1 of the very common issues with us as artists because we’ve struggled.
44:47.47SarahLast.
45:01.86charukaaroraSo much so much about being taken seriously and I think when when when from the inception of your your creative side and while growing up the way that you’re saying that your relationship with your doctor I feel like.
45:03.99SarahYeah, but.
45:20.33charukaaroraIt is such an incredible support system and it’s it just if I’m sure she gives wings to you but I’m sure it’s also the other way around.
45:30.49SarahYeah, absolutely yeah.
45:33.79charukaaroraAnd now that you have a son. How has that been going.
45:38.83SarahUm, well Samuel is um, a little dream baby I feel guilty even saying it but I don’t know how I got 1 of those but I did um, he’s. Super chill and um, yeah so I was able to get back into the studio so much sooner.
46:06.60charukaaroraWhen did you get back after habilsam.
46:11.31SarahI think when he was 3 months old but um, which you know mother a lot most mothers will now understand that that may seem like a long amount of time but it’s really.
46:28.22charukaaroraUm, take not I know it’s not.
46:29.93SarahAnd when I say I got back? Yeah when I say I got back to the studio I mean like I actually started showing up for my normal like practice which is my my studio practice happens at night I don’t I don’t get anything.
46:39.41charukaaroraCrossed.
46:48.40charukaaroraDone really.
46:49.21SarahDone during the day I try to sneak things in um, but it doesn’t really happen I need that I need to be able. Yeah I need to um, be able to so kind of sit and.
46:57.72charukaaroraUm, to understand.
47:07.00SarahAnd know that I’m not going to get interrupted. So.
47:07.86charukaaroraNow. Yeah, so little Sam is a sleepbox.
47:13.49SarahYeah, he’s a good sleeper. Well the thing is is that I mean I’m still getting up ah a couple times a night to feed him. But um, he he it’s all about how he just goes back down to sleep very well and you just put him down and he was ah.
47:21.44charukaaroraUm, you know.
47:30.65charukaaroraKeeping your fingers crossed keeping your fingers crossed I remember when so in the past month and a half year um 2 years actually or maybe whatever so we’ve had 2 children in the house and it’s for the first time that I’ve um.
47:32.89SarahI Know yes.
47:47.79charukaaroraLiterally seen children growing up because I was the youngest in my family and then another generation. That’s just my sister had babies. But of course they were growing up apart now that I’ve seen um I see my niece and my nephew every day. Ah, growing up. My niece is already 1 and my nephe is four months so at around the same time that Sam happened and I feel like 1 thing I’m not even I’m not even a mother and i’m.
48:14.83SarahAh, with.
48:22.79charukaaroraI I’m way more like way less responsible for anything and I feel like I still feel like I’ve lost time I don’t no sense of time anymore because I feel like whenever I’m home. There’s hardly I can get anything done because either of them are you know.
48:28.99SarahYeah.
48:40.70charukaaroraChildren just want so much of attention and they’re constantly that I don’t even imagine how you as mother are doing such amazing work. Um and nurturing your children and showing up for yourself as 1
48:55.67SarahWell hopefully I am doing all those things.
48:58.70charukaaroraYou are you are I If it wasn’t for that I’m sure your your daughter wouldn’t have felt the same.
49:03.50SarahI will tell you I’ll tell you how I do it toruka my house is not I I have probably 2 laundry baskets out of clothes that need to be folded sitting in my my living room. Or days. Ah yeah I mean like seriously like I I have to get 1 of those um those prints that I’ve seen that has like the order they say art first.
49:25.53charukaaroraUm, that’s that’s still better.
49:40.13charukaaroraUm, yeah.
49:41.16SarahThen the dishes then laundry or something like that. That’s way I live my life. So so it’s funny because I was ah I was actually just face timing with emily earlier and I was like okay well I have to put Sam down for a nap and. Then I’m going to ah work on you know, comping up some ideas for some paintings I was like as as you do when you have like when you’re a stay at home Mom right? So that’s where my priorities are.
50:14.18charukaaroraAh, and that’s that’s important that that really is important because that’s how you get things and I think of course um, you get something you need to let go of something that’s that you cannot fully control everything.
50:29.35SarahYeah, yeah.
50:33.75charukaaroraBut I think okay my lot like my second last question I promise which is which is ah apart from of course a physical time I think what’s really really hard and I’m saying this because I’m experience it.
50:36.81SarahNo please I’m this is fine.
50:52.00charukaaroraExperiencing this myself because I’m not even a mother but I feel like having children in the house take up so much mental space like I can literally I feel like of course a lot other things have been such a big part of my life for the far for the part previous years and but even then I feel like.
50:57.33SarahAh.
51:05.79SarahYeah.
51:10.49charukaaroraThey take so much of your mental space that it’s very hard to connect with yourself Then how did you feel that way. How do you deal with that I mean how do you fully twelve into your work when you know you have these children running outside.
51:19.79SarahUm, yeah.
51:28.73charukaaroraLike they’re living outside your body and you need to take care of them and they constantly like they need the they need their mother. Always.
51:30.48SarahI. Um, well quite simply um, they need their mother and for their mother to be a present mother I need to have my art in my life.
51:47.70charukaaroraUm, yeah, yeah.
51:52.51SarahAnd it’s so it’s like and I always I always make the comparison to the um how they always say the flight attendant say on a ah flight put your own Oxygen mask on first and then help put your child on right because you’re you’re of no use to anybody.
52:02.94charukaaroraSo.
52:09.20charukaaroraUm, yeah.
52:10.40SarahIf you’re struggling for air. Um, that’s though, that’s kind of like what my art is um and I I truly am like when I have ah ah, an active um art life.
52:16.48charukaaroraUm, you know.
52:28.93SarahAnd I’m happy with what I’m working on and you know I have a good flow going I am I am a better mother I can I can see it I can tell Um, so that’s how that’s how it happens because it’s what um.
52:34.88charukaaroraYeah, yeah, yeah. Now.
52:47.35SarahIt all works as a system together. You know.
52:47.78charukaaroraYeah, yeah I can complete yeah and like that’s really true and how do you think like this is a question with you I mean do you think you need to create boundaries or. While like as a mother and as an artist so that they don’t overtake each other um and do you practice or in what way, do you practice so that you’re fully there as a mother and then when you’re back in the studio you’re there as an artist.
53:21.45SarahUm, um, no I would say that um when I like during the day I you know obviously that’s when I’m it’s most of the the children time.
53:36.35charukaaroraUm, yeah, um.
53:40.75SarahI always have um 1 foot in the art. Would you say? yeah like that it’s it’s there and if it’s not if it’s not actively working on something then it’s the wheels are turning.
53:49.35charukaaroraAre.
53:58.57charukaaroraUm, yeah.
53:59.12SarahYou know I have like the the 2 wheels turning the 1 is like you know my family and my responsibilities to my family. The other wheel is my art and 1 1 ne’s always they’re both always turning but maybe like 1 ne’s kind of like on you know, turning a little faster when i’m.
54:03.76charukaaroraUm, yeah, and.
54:15.10charukaaroraHigher. Yeah.
54:18.80SarahAnd depending on what I’m focusing on So I guess that’s the best way I can describe it.
54:21.49charukaaroraYou are incredible I don’t even know how you do this but you just do it So good. Okay, my last question before we go into my favorite part which is the rapid fire and which is.
54:28.11SarahAh, thank you.
54:36.33SarahM.
54:41.39charukaaroraLet’s say if the world ends today and does or there’s nothing attached to what you do no show nothing I mean no extreme sent him nothing no purpose. Why would you still choose to do the work that you’re doing today. What is that 1 and that pushes you out of bed.
54:41.85SarahOkay.
54:56.17SarahIs.
55:00.52charukaaroraMake you do the work that you do.
55:05.34SarahI Actually think about this a lot. Um I actually have the like the thought in my head all the time if I were so on a stranded on an island like would I make art.
55:21.40charukaaroraYeah.
55:22.93SarahI mean obviously I would have to spend a lot of time figuring out how to survive but I I would still find ways to make art and ah.
55:36.14SarahUm I Guess I yeah, it’s like ah um for me I don’t know making Ibus might sound Corny or contrived but I like it’s like 1 of my my. Ah. My Lifelines So I you probably understand that right? So it kind of goes with breathing and eating and.
55:55.82charukaaroraYeah I given the same.
56:05.27charukaaroraYeah, yeah, making something I think um, a lot of us have this compulsive desire from at least to me I like I know even if it’s not painting or anything I need I need to continuous continuously create something.
56:21.56SarahUm, ah, that’s.
56:23.55charukaaroraEven if it’s out of trash. Even if it’s just just the desire that um my hands are working on something.
56:32.60SarahUm, I’m the same way. Yeah.
56:35.83charukaaroraLovely Oh my God All I’m so glad we had this conversation I have yeah and I had so much fun. It is my pleasure and my honor I can and there’s no.
56:40.33SarahUm, ah me too as they went by so fast will have to do more.
56:53.88charukaaroraThere’s no saying that I’m I’m going to have you back again soon and before I don’t know when is that but I’m sure we know when when is that happening.
56:56.52SarahUm, okay, good.
57:03.81SarahI don’t know. But oh the show is ah ah is September of 2022 so in a year a year from now.
57:12.40charukaaroraPerfect Hopefully before soon I’m um I wish that so many more magical things happen so that I can pull you back here again and we talk about all that really.
57:22.56SarahI Want to come on and interview you you yeah would you could we do that? Um I would love to do that because you are so special. Um.
57:31.22charukaaroraAbsolutely oh, that’s such a great idea. Let’s do that.
57:41.99SarahEver since I First saw you in 1 of the um art queen meetings and I just like you you just like a light and I just knew I was like there’s something about her. She’s very special and you’ve you’ve proven that time and time again. So I think.
57:49.87charukaaroraUm, Land guide. Oh my guy.
57:57.29SarahI Would like to come on and be a guest interviewer and interview you if that would be okay. Okay.
57:59.20charukaaroraOh my God let’s do this. It’ll be truly my honor to have you. That’s an oh my God you have to come now. Let’s let’s do this? Yes now let’s go are you ready because this is my most favorite part.
58:07.15SarahAh, okay, we’ll set it up.
58:14.79SarahYeah I know I know this part now I’m a very wordy person I will do my best to be rapid so in my responses. Okay.
58:25.18charukaaroraUm, um, will we we’ll figure it out. So are you ready? Okay here we go 1 thing that you want can convey through your work in the arts.
58:32.73SarahYes.
58:40.67SarahA human connection.
58:48.38charukaaroraWhat’s a 1 word that describes you the best.
58:51.69SarahOpen.
58:54.80charukaaroraIf you could have a studio anywhere in the world where would it be.
59:00.46SarahI Honestly what? wherever my home is I’m a I’m I’m a I’m a home studio person. It works so well for me so wherever I like right now I have my dream studio because it’s in my home.
59:05.81charukaaroraUm, you are home to your presence.
59:18.17charukaaroraOh my god you I just thank you thank you it it just feels forever. Yeah I it’s day 3 it was yesterday was day 3 So um, it’s I’m I’m going on for a small.
59:20.12SarahOh and by the way congratulations to you on your new studio I’m very excited for you? yeah.
59:37.54charukaaroraMy nieces birthday today. So we’re going for a little getaway and I feel like oh my god I’ll have to miss 2 days. Yeah, but yeah.
59:41.45SarahOh you have to leave? Oh it’s gonna be nice to come back? Well please um, post a lot of videos and photos so we can see the space as it comes together.
59:51.46charukaaroraDone Oh my God and I can’t wait to do that. Okay, your biggest source of inspiration and of balance now I think.
01:00:00.64SarahAh, my biggest source I And so I mean yeah, it’s ah of for sure my my kids or motherhood I’d say ah more motherhood because it’s the role of motherhood. Yeah.
01:00:12.30charukaaroraNear? Yeah yeah, okay, who is your favorite women artist from any point of time.
01:00:24.80SarahUm, can I give like 1 living 1 dead maybe like 1 Okay, um, so my ah deceased artist is probably.
01:00:31.84charukaaroraAny any any. Any.
01:00:43.77SarahI don’t know I haven’t listened to every single 1 of your episodes but I’m sure you’ve gotten this 1 a lot um is ah my girl free to kalo and I mean I can’t like I I I can’t think of anybody else who.
01:00:52.31charukaaroraYeah, a lot.
01:01:00.73charukaaroraUm, yeah, and yeah.
01:01:03.50SarahI I just admire her so much how she painted her her reality and her pain and suffering but and unapologetically I mean she’s been such a source of inspiration.
01:01:10.53charukaaroraYeah, and I think and I think why she’s so popular, especially amongst women and artists like us. It’s because um I think it’s it’s the story of all of us you all like it’s not only Feeda. We. All feel that every day of a lie and it feels like it’s been for centuries and like we all still relate to those experiences as a woman and that’s amazing.
01:01:30.97SarahIs.
01:01:38.41SarahYes I am I have to tell you that Oh well, this is not rapid I was about to tell you a story. Ah I Um I had a very.
01:01:45.91charukaaroraGo ahead? No no go ahead. We don’t want to miss the story.
01:01:57.98SarahProfoundly, ah, um, spiritual moment I was I was in Detroit at the ah the d I the took detroit institute of art where diego rivera has um this.
01:02:14.21charukaaroraUm, yeah.
01:02:16.57SarahVery famous mural that he did and and um I stood there looking at it and it was the also the time that Frida painted 1 of her my very favorite paintings of hers. Um. About her miscarriage and it was there. It was there in Detroit that she had had it and I was actually going through a miscarriage myself at the time and it was just like this Ah yeah, it was pretty profound and moving. So um, she’s yeah.
01:02:36.70charukaaroraNo.
01:02:43.36charukaaroraYeah, yeah. Um, my god. I think this is something that now because it’s not so rapid rapid let me also share something you know so I grew up in India and in India we did not. We never had had this culture of you know art.
01:02:55.69SarahShe’s amazing.
01:03:15.22charukaaroraBuying art or like you know, special living artists or like it was ah if you’re buying art. It was very aristocratic like only people on the higher end would do that or otherwise it was very religious So very mass produced. You know you we would have like these calendars with um.
01:03:21.12SarahUm, yeah. Um.
01:03:34.21charukaaroraYou know the gods and the religion the published and everything so we never really had like this culture of buying art I and we of course we grew up very modestly. So Of course we were not in the place at that point to even think about buying art. Something like that. Then of course I I was the creative My my parents of course were always very. My mom was I think if I had anything in me which is creativity is because of her and even when you’re saying you know the way you mention your relationship with your daughter.
01:04:04.18SarahIs.
01:04:12.17charukaaroraIn terms of making I remember my I was very young I think probably I was 6 7 whatever and my mom would go to like she did this fashion course and she was she does brilliant drawings I always encourage her to do more but I just she never caught the courage back to get into it. And I remember all night she would work because during the day we were 3 children so she would take care of us and at night she used to have college in the morning she would go like a couple of hours in the morning but throughout the night she would do her fashion lastrations and like like embroidering and then embellishing and like and i.
01:04:43.30SarahNow.
01:04:49.74charukaaroraI Have literally picked my love for embellishment and the textiles and everything because of her because I have lived. She’s she’s literally taking me to every every thrift shop every every material shop everywhere because I would be alongside her.
01:04:54.90SarahAh, that’s beautiful.
01:05:08.61charukaaroraSo my point was I I now I’ve forgotten what I was sharing.
01:05:12.37SarahThat’s okay because we were talking about something beautiful. So I don’t even care what your point was ah.
01:05:17.10charukaaroraUm, yeah, oh yeah, art. So yeah, so that was the kind of art that actually I grew up with and I always this is and this is a question that’s very very important to me because I feel like when you don’t believe in. Anything that I do I need to have such a strong conviction in it only then I know I I’ll I’ll get through the other end of it and I keep asking myself this question because I did not grow up without I never spend that money I never saw anyone do that and. I would always ask myself this question. Why would someone buy buy my art. Why would someone buy my art because for me, it was just only something that I make and then I put it back. You know you may art and then you put it Back. You don’t sell it. Why would someone buy and because that’s how it happened for me I Never saw someone buy and I never bought 1 and then eventually.
01:05:51.61SarahWith.
01:05:59.66SarahUm, ah.
01:06:08.71charukaaroraSo I started buying a few I think in the past last 2 years or so ah also because the traditional definition of what art buying is I love collecting things but things I never collected art during the pandemic was when I got my answer and that’s what you.
01:06:26.15SarahOh.
01:06:28.63charukaaroraLike the thing that you said I I saw these pieces hung and they were not even really hung hung because I did not have space enough and they were just there and 1 of my own pieces I’m not even saying anyone else is right now that’s just in my room and I was having such a hard time. I Would every day come back and I would just look at that and it was just it just I feel I felt like it spoke to me I felt like it was reminding me of something if there was a good picture if there was I remember this book I don’t know if you remember if you know Julia Emily’s really nice friends. She does these? um.
01:06:52.75SarahOh.
01:07:07.30charukaaroraA ac caustic flow for kind of 1 Yeah I love her I can’t wait to have. She’s also coming on the path so we did I did my photo. Yeah and we did a first artist swap so I did my first artist swap with her.
01:07:07.31SarahOh Juliana Yeah, yeah, oh you, you guys would have a good show together. Ah.
01:07:21.10SarahOh I Love that it’s my favorite.
01:07:25.38charukaaroraYeah, and then I had her work and every time I would just come to the studio and I would just you know the idea I realized that how subconsciously I mean how much a difference I don’t think if those works were there. They wouldn’t really uplift me because I had no other reason to feel uplifted.
01:07:41.88SarahAnd.
01:07:43.50charukaaroraBut every time I would come back and see something I felt like I was taking I was taken away either I felt belonged because it was even hard to feel belonged or I felt understood or I felt I was there was an escape into something but that that time I felt like if I did not have these place these like. This art near me. How incredibly hard would I be and that’s like and I’m sharing this because the ways that you said that you know it gives you so much of belongingness you were going through the same experience and another artist at ears yours it like.
01:08:03.98SarahAnd yeah.
01:08:15.84SarahYeah.
01:08:22.43SarahUm, yeah.
01:08:23.40charukaaroraSo many years ago had a very similar experience and she’s she made something about it and you after so many years are still like you feel belonged because of something like that. How beautiful is that isn’t it.
01:08:35.18SarahAbsolutely yeah, it is. It is beautiful. Yeah, it’s it. It’s such a um, a way to connect. You know that you can’t really get in any it I don’t know. Yeah.
01:08:51.49charukaaroraUm, yeah, okay back to the rapid fire as we.
01:08:53.60SarahBeautiful. I Told you told you you ah.
01:09:00.71charukaaroraYou let’s let’s let’s go back. Let’s let’s get back to right? Okay, are you ready back again. Okay, who is a bo person when you’re in trouble or need of advice.
01:09:07.31SarahYeah.
01:09:13.92SarahUm, for for life things. My mom for sure. Um, and um and also my twin sister.
01:09:20.55charukaaroraOh well.
01:09:32.90SarahDepending on the the thing um and then for our I’m I’m just like I’m very fortunate to have a lot of resources in that area I I guess I over the years created that for myself having that group support. So um.
01:09:41.50charukaaroraYet? yeah.
01:09:51.56SarahUm, emily mula is the as definitely like I call her a machine. She’s a she’s a machine. She’s just like ah it’s very inspiring to talk to? Um, yeah, and then I have my my art night group I have a zoom art night
01:09:51.93charukaaroraYes, Yes, yeah I know that? yeah. So She’s very I yeah.
01:10:08.69SarahBut that I meet with a couple nights a week and there but we have like a you know, not just those meetings but we have a group chat that you know has been really amazing. Um, because you can reach out in the middle of your crisis in the middle of the day and.
01:10:23.23charukaaroraYet.
01:10:28.48SarahAnd my husband too he whether he likes it or not. He’s my immediate founding board for for many things. So yeah.
01:10:34.92charukaaroraAnd okay, that is amazing and since we are not on the rapid fire I want to take this another chance and really talk about the art night crew I have this person so I what how did that.
01:10:45.10SarahOh yeah.
01:10:51.32SarahAh, ah scratching. Ah yes.
01:10:51.52charukaaroraNow she let let me just let us pass. So so basically when I am recording I need to bring all of them inside I have 3 so I need to bring all of them in i.
01:11:01.21SarahI Love I Love it I Love seeing pictures of your dogs. They’re so beautiful.
01:11:06.51charukaaroraAh, and then they keep banging now my ah the 1 is just sitting night right next to me and she wants to come up. Okay, okay, can you talk about the art night group because I think it is such an amazing concept. How did it start and what are you guys doing.
01:11:14.97SarahThat’s right.
01:11:21.57SarahYeah, yeah, and that you know I I feel I feel like any interview I’ve done I’ve always brought it up because it has been such a ah big influence. So um, back in October of. 2018 or 2019 I forget which Year um I was accepted into um it was an all women’s art fair and danielle crisso was the curator for it.
01:11:56.67charukaaroraCome out.
01:11:58.88SarahAnd it was through Jen tough gallery. She was the 1 hosing it was in San francisco and I applied like just like oh this is such a long shot and then all of a sudden I found out I was accepted and had to figure out I was like oh I got to go to san francisco.
01:12:11.98charukaaroraSo.
01:12:18.42SarahUm, so there I met like the most amazing group of women. Um, and ah I’d say Ah so. What happened was when I when I came back and I kept in touch with many of them. Um, Danny bi a car up. Do you know her she? yeah okay, she’s amazing. Um, so she was actually I think the connector so she was actually part of some thrive groups. Do you know thrive.
01:12:42.81charukaaroraYeah I follow her.
01:12:53.72charukaaroraYeah, yeah I know they were quite a thing at some point.
01:12:56.53SarahRight? Mastermind. So yeah, um, so she was in those groups and she liked the format of having a group of of you know women that you spoke to and she kind of started her own I guess. Ah. Just it just became like a ah night hey you want to get on zoome and make art together and hang out and um I was a little hesitant at first because I was like oh does that vibe with my like my studio style like how I work and stuff because. Um, but and then and I I went along and and did it and I got hooked and um, it turned from 1 night into 2 nights and um I think there’s like ah there’s been different people coming in and out. Um, but I think there’s about.
01:13:49.57charukaaroraRound.
01:13:53.18SarahAbout solid 10 of us now I’d say and we meet on zoome and and um from all over ah a couple of us are from the east coast of the states and.
01:13:54.90charukaaroraUm, wow.
01:14:09.93SarahThere’s a few people from the west coast and then a lot of west cook a lot of canadians I love my canadians. so um yeah so a few of them are from that ladies room event and um.
01:14:13.69charukaaroraUm, wow.
01:14:27.42SarahWe’ve just kind of added here and there like Carmen is is ah I brought her in on that group. So yeah, it’s awesome and um, twice 2 nights a week
01:14:28.57charukaaroraYeah, and do how often do you guys Meet. Um, and you’ve been doing that religiously since then.
01:14:43.20SarahAh I mean it’s like we we all go through periods where there’s some. There’s some you know what? I mean so there will be sometimes we show up and there’s only a couple people but um yeah. but yeah yeah
01:14:50.40charukaaroraYeah, absolutely yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, but it’s still hanging I mean it’s still going on every 2 1 Oh wow oh wow and I remember you doing such a fantastic but email.
01:15:01.68SarahYeah, yeah, it’s still going strong.
01:15:08.35charukaaroraWell I don’t remember what that was called but there was all of you came together and you did this 1 piece each person thing remember? yeah yeah I oh my god that was.
01:15:16.72SarahThe circle like arts our circle collection where we yeah we decided to release a collection together. Yeah oh thanks, yeah, that was that was fun that was cool. Um.
01:15:25.58charukaaroraSo Fantastic. My good. It’s It’s so nice to see I think um, this is and I think because to me I never had that that kind of immediate support system and community and that is why like I literally had to pick like.
01:15:33.21SarahYeah.
01:15:49.17charukaaroraPush myself that I need to find something that really makes me feel belong or connected to and I do know like in the past 2 years that I’ve found so many of you that I’ve truly feel so connected to it’s made so much of difference and I’m sure like the kind of this kind of a relationship that you’re talking about that must have had like.
01:15:57.97SarahUm, yeah.
01:16:08.14charukaaroraIt must have added so much value in your life and your practice.
01:16:09.42SarahAh, absolutely I don’t know how I would have gotten through the pandemic without that you know and I also feel like um, yeah, even the connections that we’ve been able to make for the past couple years all through.
01:16:14.33charukaaroraUm, yeah.
01:16:29.24SarahPeople that we’ve never met in person is phenomenal likere. Yeah through the art queens is you know how I met you and then um I mean carmen who I now consider 1 of my closest friends is ah that all started just on like I was actually going to ask her the other day like how do.
01:16:29.54charukaaroraShe Yeah yeah.
01:16:39.71charukaaroraSaid.
01:16:47.65charukaaroraUm, yeah, and she’s amazing. She’s such such such a nice person. Such an amazing person. Yeah I’m so grateful for I think technology has given us.
01:16:48.20SarahI know it was through Instagram like we message each other but how we just connected you know? Yeah oh my goodness. Yeah.
01:17:07.22charukaaroraSo much otherwise I don’t feel like I’m just sitting literally in 1 corner of the world and you guys have another corner of the world and I feel like it I oh like I can’t even imagine if I wouldn’t have met you guys because it means so much to me? yes.
01:17:11.87SarahYeah, for sure.
01:17:22.19SarahYeah, same.
01:17:26.87charukaaroraOkay, back to rapper file.
01:17:28.66SarahAh, the but the most Unwrapid fire. Ah the slope. Why do we call this count should we cut rename this the slow burn. Ah.
01:17:31.55charukaaroraFire this the the slow fire.
01:17:41.37charukaaroraYeah, is there even a bond right now This slow slow This is this is the choice to the sa.
01:17:46.39SarahAh, the slow slow burn with ah Sarah dotweiler.
01:17:52.29charukaaroraThis is the new twist to this episode welcome to another and you move specially specially catered for so a solidadway trailer and I’m going with the flow. Oh my God This is so fun. Okay, my next question.
01:17:57.80SarahAh.
01:18:04.66SarahUm, ah.
01:18:11.16charukaaroraNow and you you now since we are taking over liberties take your time if you were to meet youngest Sara today. What advice would you give up.
01:18:15.10SarahThank you.
01:18:20.84SarahOh my gosh. Oh my goodness. Oh you know I did that um I did a whole ah postcard series called a twenty day conversation with your 20 year old self I don’t know if you knew that.
01:18:32.50charukaaroraUm, yes.
01:18:38.23charukaarorano no no no no I do know about this 1
01:18:39.43SarahDid that a lot like a while back? Yeah, that was ah um, ah a few years back now. Um because but based on a conversation like this where my friend said.
01:18:52.40charukaaroraOkay.
01:18:58.47SarahYou know what would you tell your or I actually ask my friends what what would you tell your 20 year old self I’m now forty 2 so we’re going back a little bit but ah, um, ah.
01:18:59.10charukaaroraHear this.
01:19:06.32charukaaroraYou still look 16 I mean it.
01:19:17.26SarahAnd what it it started with ah my friend’s response. Um, which now I’m forgetting which was like the whole the first 1 that I did but I did these illustrations um based on and they were like Basically. Ah. Portraits where the the voice bubble was like had a profile had a face and it was talking to yourself basically and I just really delved into it and thought about all the things I would say so it’s interesting because before when we were talking about the rebellion through art that that.
01:19:40.65charukaaroraSo um.
01:19:52.94charukaaroraUm, you know.
01:19:55.84SarahThat would be a big thing. Um I would tell um but I yeah I don’t know I think I would I would say just ah.
01:20:16.70SarahDon’t try to please other people because that was I think good that got in my way for many years being a people pleaser you know.
01:20:21.39charukaaroraYeah, yeah, it’s true and it’s such a hard thing. It’s like does it even like it’s not a linear girl right? It’s not even I mean it’s not a linear thing car. It is.
01:20:33.76SarahUm, yeah.
01:20:40.41charukaaroraAnd think it keeps coming going back. You rediscover yourself and then you fall back into the trap and then you read rediscover yourself and then fall back into your trap not but okay, shout out to an artist or many that are currently on your heart list last that your lobby.
01:20:41.97SarahUm, yeah, yeah.
01:20:57.28SarahUm I can say more than 1 right? I I mean I’ve already talked to I’ve already talked about a couple of them carmen mara um, she’s killing it right now.
01:21:01.40charukaaroraUm, yeah, yeah.
01:21:12.50charukaaroraYes.
01:21:17.11SarahI’m so happy. Um, all the attention she’s getting for her art which is so deserved and um, she just keeps like building her her body of work is just getting more and more exciting to me and I actually have 1 of her pillow pieces.
01:21:22.10charukaaroraAnd yeah.
01:21:29.47charukaaroraUm, yeah I I Yeah, let’s take this moment and really appreciate where she’s going I can I So so agree with you because I’ve been blown away by those cultural pen pieces.
01:21:34.68SarahWhich is.
01:21:44.54SarahAh, love them I told her I I need to happen.
01:21:48.56charukaaroraLike I’m such a spammo and I like every so scar in and I keep like sp like sp I spammer more than she really is and then like she’ll pause this and I’ll come like.
01:22:03.84SarahIt’s not spam when it’s coming from you. Ah.
01:22:06.98charukaaroraAh, and I do that with so many of you and like oh my god I want this and like why are you doing this I like I feel like and I keep 1 thing that I keep messaging her every time is um, every time she posts 1 and I’m like you know what? this makes me fall in love with your work even more today.
01:22:24.98SarahYeah.
01:22:26.71charukaaroraThis makes me fall. Love they’re working and it’s just and it’s just gotten I’ve seen her like from this like I remember when we started speaking she was very like shy and she was close and I’ve seen her like opening up so beautifully in the walk that she’s making right now I see like it’s.
01:22:40.69SarahUm, yeah. Ah, yeah, yeah, she’s fantastic. Um I Love everything about her. Ah definitely a shout out to Emily mullet Again. Um.
01:22:46.48charukaaroraJust outstanding. It’s It’s completely outstanding.
01:23:00.66charukaaroraYes.
01:23:05.49SarahAnd I oh um, Crystal Latimer. Do you know her work. Um.
01:23:11.38charukaaroraOh I have been following up with her for so long to be on the podcast I can’t I’m obsessed with her work really off obsessed.
01:23:21.22SarahI’m obsessed to go I Um, she so another connection to that create Magazine show. She was in that issue and our pieces hung next to each other.
01:23:29.93charukaaroraOh oh my god.
01:23:36.57SarahAnd I love like I she was like her piece was like my favorite in the show and then um, we so we kind of stayed connected. She’s also in Pennsylvania but she’s in Pittsburgh I’m on the you know she’s more on the west side I’m in the east but um.
01:23:47.65charukaaroraUm, and yeah.
01:23:54.20SarahShe also had was in a feature collection show and sold out and yeah and then and she is um, she’s going to have a show with paris solo show with paradigm in October this october next month and I just like.
01:23:57.37charukaaroraSo yeah I remember that.
01:24:07.47charukaaroraOh my? um.
01:24:12.90SarahYou know you know when you see somebody’s art and like you like actually groan I’m like oh every time I see yeah I can’t take it I’m like it’s like ah like feelings of like I just can’t I’m obsess I can’t get enough.
01:24:14.74charukaaroraI. I I feel you want that I feel you and like.
01:24:32.89SarahUm I need to have it I wish that I had made a like off. Ah yeah.
01:24:35.62charukaaroraYeah, with you so much with you and that I so feel the same for her I remember like she did have keep 6 1 that that absolutely was so so so so stunning and then before that also she did 1 of the series that.
01:24:45.40SarahYeah.
01:24:53.35charukaaroraSo I can’t remember the title for that 1 but ever since I think that’s when I found out and these spoken quite a bit in Wi between and like I feel like now that we’re also talking about this and I love this I Why I love this rabbit fire gives us so much more than the actual conversation. Such a short Time. You know this is something that. Tristan and I even spoke about it because she was like you know I Really like your work and I was like I Absolutely like I’m obsessed with your work and we have this very ah in terms of the way that we um approach our of this little similarity like the texture and that you know.
01:25:26.40SarahUm, yeah, like the ornamental kind of yeah.
01:25:31.60charukaaroraThe embellished like yeah, yeah, and she was like you know I feel like we have such a similar ground and that’s what I feel like even now even with you I feel like we all somehow for see each other. Um I mean with common Also I feel like. Especially as a woman. Um, and then how she’s used her I think something as simple as thread I mean some seem as simple as thread and just below. She’s created something that’s that’s so so amazing and that’s what crystal you.
01:25:57.52SarahYeah.
01:26:05.93SarahYeah.
01:26:10.40charukaaroraI Feel like it is so inspiring so inspiring.
01:26:12.85SarahNow. Well you’re you’re inspiring too. So we got to do a trade you and I ah.
01:26:19.51charukaaroraOh are you? This is my dream come true I am so I can’t wait to have oh my God that will be so.
01:26:28.98SarahWe Well I promise you we will do a trade I just have to have the work the actual work to um to.
01:26:34.22charukaaroraYeah, just let me know when you are done and I’ll be there for you amazing! Okay, my last question to this. Not so Rapid slow burn. Okay.
01:26:49.62SarahAh, ah.
01:26:53.60charukaaroraOne last question which is as as an artist a mother or woman There’s so many people I think we all play so many roles in between ah that we play so many roles in between and. What is that 1 or 2 advice that you would want to give to people to begin, especially artists who are coming behind you.
01:27:23.50SarahUm.
01:27:23.51charukaaroraMore but coming my dar 1 with them.
01:27:28.78SarahI Feel like ah it’s probably my the mantra that I’m telling myself right now. Um is trust your gut. Ah, and.
01:27:41.86charukaaroraYeah.
01:27:46.46SarahAnd you you have to keep calling upon that because I mean you know I don’t know I I don’t know about every artist but I still every time I approach a new show I’m like what if nobody likes it.
01:27:51.91charukaaroraDo that.
01:28:03.65charukaaroraSo did yes yes.
01:28:04.50SarahYou know and I am I’m actually um with this next show I’m ah exploring ah a slightly new direction. Um, and I was I was scared I was like at my like.
01:28:15.61charukaaroraMan.
01:28:23.83SarahAh, had to give my myself permission and trust my guy and um a friend of mine ash woodworth from my art night she was ah you know her work. Um, she said a great thing. She’s like you know.
01:28:32.88charukaaroraUm, yeah, yeah.
01:28:41.95SarahYou Your gut is what told you is what got you these you know your success to this point. So why don’t you just go with that and so yeah.
01:28:47.29charukaaroraYeah, yeah, so well with the Countman Trust your guide. That’s that’s so obvious. But so forgotten.
01:29:02.97SarahUm, yeah, and it’s hard. It’s hard to do.
01:29:06.50charukaaroraWhere or God so hard I think we we trust ourselves so less and we trust mopi like other people apart from our own so much more if we trust ourselves more how I mean again saying.
01:29:17.15SarahYeah, yeah.
01:29:24.50charukaaroraIt’s easier said than done and I would of of course I don’t practice this myself completely. But it but every time I’m sure you would also watch for this that every time we’ve trusted our own cuts more and what people believe it’s always work better.
01:29:37.68SarahUm, yeah.
01:29:41.10charukaaroraOh my god Sara you know I knew I had a feeling that this this episode will touch 2 hours and where we are taught 1 hour thirty minutes now so we are quite close to what I thought I really thought that this wouldn’t end up oh my god this is i.
01:29:56.78SarahI I was like lets make it a 2 hour episode ah work. We the length of a feature film right now right.
01:30:08.62charukaaroraAbsolutely yeah, so this is like why the feature, the arts 2 hearts feature film on sorrow to filela the slow by the slow 1
01:30:15.37SarahUm, if it let’s make a trailer the slope in the introduction of the very first slow burn.
01:30:24.74charukaaroraThis is the launch of the slow burn and you’ve aged it.
01:30:29.83SarahAh, thank you I’m very good at using way too many words to say make a simple point. Ah.
01:30:33.39charukaaroraUm, you you’re definite but you definitely made a ah lot of very good points So give it you given you’ve given we’ve given that to you.
01:30:41.68SarahOkay, hope so.
01:30:49.16charukaaroraOh my god I I feel like we could do another few hours for sure. But I don’t I I want I know little Sam and the little girl both of them are waiting for you I don’t want to take much of your time which are already taking but I have 1 more last question.
01:30:51.60SarahYeah I.
01:31:03.51SarahYeah, of course.
01:31:06.29charukaaroraKnow 1 part of it that you have an upcoming show which is happening in 202044 whom I have also also forgotten what you are we learning in now Twenty Twenty Twenty two October but we will definitely be doing so much more in between that. But.
01:31:09.89SarahYeah.
01:31:24.43charukaaroraDo you have anything else that you want to share any project anything and where people can find you support you or just use this space to share anything that you want about your work.
01:31:35.11SarahAh, yeah I do have a couple things so um the I so I sold out my last 2 shows which is a great problem to have but it also means and then I add a baby like right after. So.
01:31:48.70charukaaroraUm, any.
01:31:54.30SarahUm I don’t have a whole lot of work right available right now to um to I kind of have to put all my energy towards my show. So I’m not you know.
01:31:57.35charukaaroraUm.
01:32:07.55SarahTo submit to things or do some other shows. It would be nice if I could do that But the nice thing is that I yeah I am able to do some of these virtual shows that are popping up so I don’t know if you do you know? I’m roar roaring artists gallery.
01:32:08.10charukaaroraYes, yeah.
01:32:17.53charukaaroraUm, yeah, are new.
01:32:24.94SarahUm, so roaring artists Gallery is ah ah, it’s gonna be a virtual show and um I’m I’m sorry I’m looking up really quick to see when the.
01:32:34.23charukaaroraOkay.
01:32:44.35SarahUm, I’m actually gonna be in it with carmen and ah Robin kenny if you know her and nora how la lauren dawson. Um.
01:32:46.23charukaaroraOh wow.
01:32:52.31charukaaroraUm, yes, are.
01:33:02.20SarahAm I forgetting Ah but the founder is Katie Bradford Osborn and that’s roaring artists gallery dot com. So she puts together. She’s curated a virtual show and it’s opens November Fifteenth I think um.
01:33:09.51charukaaroraBut here. But.
01:33:15.94charukaaroraAh, okay, um.
01:33:21.90SarahAnd I was able to put some hidden in mother pieces in it. Um, because it didn’t need to be available which is nice but um I am actually going to be releasing some some print some large prints of some of the Hiddenn mothers.
01:33:30.86charukaaroraUm, Wow That’s tonight.
01:33:37.25SarahUm, through paradigm and that will be probably the beginning of November um, and other than that my big thing was this interview with you. So.
01:33:47.90charukaaroraOh my God You oh my God That’s become a highlight for me now and finally after months of pulling you here I’ve made this possible such a victory for me in between this, you’ve had a baby.
01:33:56.55SarahUm, yes, ah thank you for your patience.
01:34:06.45charukaaroraAbsolutely, you’ve had a baby, you’ve sold out 2 shows. Oh my god that’s so much that’s already happened.
01:34:11.00SarahYeah, it has been a big ah big year
01:34:14.69charukaaroraYeah, and I will link the show that you mentioned and all other things. So anyone who’s listening to this episode you believe me, you don’t want to miss out buying Sallas brands which who knows. You will be able to get your hands on or no because you know sad has a um history of selling things out even before they are dead then of course the.
01:34:40.20SarahThere’s a pressure that so.
01:34:43.65charukaaroraSo yeah, go go go. Don’t forget to sign up for that I will link sa website the upcoming shows and everything else. So make sure you go and check out the show notes on and www dot dotha project dot com you go and click on podcast and you’ll see sals photo. And this episode and if you go and you’ll find all the details there. Okay I can’t believe thank you so much. Sarah I can’t believe this has come to an end I I wish ah me to let’s do that when whenever you’re here.
01:35:09.27SarahThank you I Know it’s like I don’t want to say goodbye but I do want to get on here and interview you. So Let’s get that in the works. Thank you,? It’s ah it it really was an honor.
01:35:22.27charukaaroraReady. Let’s do that. It. It is my honor Absolutely thank you so much I’m giving a big big virtual hug and hopefully next year I see you in person I really am making that possible and hopefully we show soon together in real life and have.
01:35:30.32SarahThank you same? yes.
01:35:41.47SarahUm, ah yes, yes, you have a beautiful day I see the sun I see the sun coming up and I’m I’m a for gonna be going to bed soon.
01:35:44.94charukaaroraOh my god that would be so fun. So sending you a big. Yeah, but yes so I’m going to start my day and you can go off to a beautiful tree with sam.
01:35:58.88SarahOkay, yes, thank you My love all right? You too. Love you.
01:36:04.80charukaaroraSending your becon. Thank you so much. Love you bye. Are.

INTERNATIONAL CALL FOR MIXED MEDIA ARTISTS

A collaboration between @artstoheartsproject & @ilikeyourwork 

Guest curator: @erika , Founder of @ilikeyourwork 

Theme: FACADE

Eligibility: Mixed media artists from around the world

Deadline: 30th of October, 2021 12 midnight EST

SUBMIT LINK: https://artstoheartsproject.com/facade-art-exhibit-submission-page/

CATEGORIES:

Charuka Arora

Charuka Arora is a creator at heart. An Artists, designer, podcaster & founder of Arts To Hearts Project. She is Internationally recognised artist
 known for her hand crafted Indian embellished collages & paintings.
Her work has been featured in several international worldwide blogs and publications, including create magazine, candy floss magazine, Fad magazine, The Jealous Curator, visionary art collective, art mums united, Indian artists book of colour to name a few.

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