Artists: Your Next Step Doesn’t Have to Be Big – S5E09

This set effectively summarizes and segments the detailed content of the interview into easily navigable chapters for viewers.

00:00 Introduction and Background
02:57 The Life of an Illustrator
06:01 Balancing Multiple Projects
08:58 The Importance of Intent in Art
12:00 Creative Vulnerability and Personal Connection
14:47 Breakthrough Moments in Creativity
23:54 Embracing the Creative Journey
25:50 Overcoming Fears in Art and Life
27:31 The Transition from College to Career
29:57 Finding Inspiration and Learning from Others
32:27 The Blessings of a Creative Career
33:00 Navigating the Freelance World
37:17 Building a Freelance Career
40:40 Researching Opportunities in Illustration
43:01 Taking Initiative and Reaching Out
44:51 Closing Thoughts and Future Aspirations

Sarah Walsh (00:00.216)
Thank you so much. It’s just for you.

Charuka (00:00.996)
that makes it even more special. Like, you know, you’ve really put me off my bed here on my desk. So it really, really worked. I’m like, look at her and look at me. I’m like, what the hell am I doing? There’s such a good intro to the podcast also. I mean, see how we started. And this is as honest as honest it can get like when I was, you know, coming back.

Sarah Walsh (00:10.574)
Thank you.

No.

Charuka (00:30.764)
I was like, this is already 10pm. I’m feeling sick. I’m not feeling well. I just had my antibiotic and I know right after this conversation, I’m going to go to bed. And I was like, maybe today I can skip looking good or putting effort. And when I saw you, I’m like,

Sarah Walsh (00:44.814)
You still look beautiful. You look beautiful to me. I don’t know what, if this is your bad day, then forget it. I don’t know. Like you look gorgeous.

Charuka (00:52.387)
So you motivated me. I put in little effort while I said let me move from there to here. Welcome to the podcast, Sara. How are you?

Sarah Walsh (01:01.846)
I’m good. are you? mean, I know how you are because I just we got the run by but yeah, I hope you’re better soon. Yes.

Charuka (01:03.617)
very bad for the stage.

Thank you so much. So now that we’re live on the podcast, how about you first introduce yourself, who you are for everybody who’s joined us. And you know, lot of people would be watching this live as well, depending on their time zones. But just introduce yourself. We’d love to hear in your way.

Sarah Walsh (01:22.478)
Okay.

Sarah Walsh (01:31.16)
Yeah, I am Sarah Walsh and I’m an illustrator. That’s what I do for a living. But I just, I’ve been an artist like many of you since I was a kid and I just am lucky that I can do it and you know, I can take a blank piece of paper and I can do a drawing and then someone gives me money. I think kind of the coolest thing ever.

And I feel really lucky. Not that there’s not challenges, but I typically make children’s books. I illustrate children’s books. I also work with different commercial clients like Blue Q and Ibu. They’re both gift product companies and Ibu’s puzzles. Those are just a few of my clients.

Charuka (01:59.979)
Absolutely.

Sarah Walsh (02:29.542)
And then I run an online shop where my partner, who’s also an illustrator, we sell our sort of where our personal work gets funneled and we can try different platforms, t-shirts, art prints, enamel pins, stickers. And that is through Etsy that we do that. And then I also run a Patreon where I have a mail subscription.

Charuka (02:29.667)
Hmm.

Charuka (02:48.204)
Hmm.

Sarah Walsh (02:57.93)
And I have like a community Zoom and we do live draws and things like that. It’s called Slow Mo Art Club. And then I’m, this last one, it’s not a paid gig, but I’m on the board of this ICON conference. So we’re planning the 13th illustration conference for ICON. So that’s coming up in the summer. And I think that’s it.

Charuka (03:05.227)
Okay.

Charuka (03:17.652)
wow!

Sarah Walsh (03:25.934)
That’s kind of the bulk of what I juggle on a day-to-day basis. Yeah, it’s kind of a lot. I’m not going to lie. Sometimes it’s, but you know, as a lot of freelance illustrators and commercial graphic design, it’s kind of like, you know, the cool thing is when I, like, if I don’t have any commercial,

Charuka (03:26.282)
That’s it.

Yeah, that’s a lot already.

Charuka (03:46.082)
Here,

Sarah Walsh (03:52.61)
Illustration clients like sometimes there’s a month or two that goes by and It’s hard not to you know freak out, but I’ve been doing this long enough where If you have more than one thing going on you can especially that’s like self Directed like my shop is I run it nobody’s telling me to do that So when it’s slow for commercial stuff, I can kind of pivot and focus on making some fun new stuff You know

Charuka (04:01.378)
Speak out. Yeah.

Charuka (04:09.547)
Yeah.

Charuka (04:17.985)
focus.

Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (04:22.189)
in my shop or I can you know work on Patreon I mean it just kind of all it just once in a while it’ll get like crunchy where there’s a season where I have like people needing things for me in like all of those different buckets and that’s when I’m like but thankfully it’s not like that all the time so

Charuka (04:42.847)
I can imagine what’s going on in your head. mean, you know, when I also feel like there’s so many things and I’m very much like you like, I really like even though it’s too much having so many things to do, but I also find it very interesting and very playful because I think one thing that it really helps is like, you know, if something’s not going right, I even though I know I’m freaking out internally, but I put my energy into something else, which becomes like another creation energy.

And then it really like it’s like confusing your mind. You don’t give it enough time to even like, you know, know that, I don’t have this as the moment, you know, I don’t have enough clients and I don’t know if I will but I have a shop I can create something new and, you know, do something.

Sarah Walsh (05:14.283)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (05:31.59)
Yeah, totally focusing on things you can control. know, unfortunately, I know back in the day, like in the eighties, like a lot of folks were making a living just doing one thing like licensing was huge. But now I think as a, as an illustrator, you really do have to have like multiple streams of income. And I think it’s kind of up to individual to know.

Charuka (05:48.533)
Yeah.

Charuka (05:55.752)
Magic. Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (06:01.005)
One, it’s too much. And especially like when you’re starting out, I think it’s good to sort of start with maybe one or two things and perfect those things. And then, you know, add more as you go. And then there’s always like a time where you reassess. You’re like, is this juggling act working for me? Does something need to go? And I’m kind of in that, you know, I’m, I’m sort of reassessing things every now and then to figure out like, because at the bottom of it all,

Charuka (06:03.328)
Hmm

Charuka (06:16.288)
Mm.

Hmm.

Sarah Walsh (06:30.111)
I was talking to a friend yesterday about like, I think one of the things that I’ve, I’ve known for a long time and I, I don’t want to get too preachy about it, but like, I think if you’re going to run a creative business in order to sustain it, you really have to think of it as like, I love my cheesy metaphors. Like your creativity is like a well and it’s got to be deep because

Charuka (06:56.682)
Okay.

Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (07:00.205)
You’re drawing from it to run this sort of heart and intuitively business. It’s not based on data. It’s based on something that you almost can’t like put your finger on in a way. It’s running on like human spirit basically, which sounds very woo-woo, but it really is. So if you don’t have a well deep enough to draw from and

Charuka (07:05.609)
Yeah.

Charuka (07:11.646)
Must see.

Charuka (07:16.276)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (07:24.305)
mine those gems and keep filling it up, then it’s just not going to make it. And so you really do in the beginning have to commit and dig that and spend time in that in order to draw from it as a sustainable business, I think. And so I make sure it’s kind of hard lately, but I know I start to feel really weird and like bad when I don’t make art for myself. Like it’s basically the

Charuka (07:52.936)
Yeah, yeah, I get that feeling. also like, you know, what’s even what’s how long have you been running your shop? Let’s even talk about

Sarah Walsh (07:53.826)
that holds everything together.

Sarah Walsh (08:06.535)
My shop, about 15 years, and I don’t have, yeah, well, and I wanted to, I thought about this yesterday, I was like, I wanted to make sure I brought this up. I’m, in a lot of ways, I think my career’s been sort of slow burn in the shop aspect. We don’t sell a whole lot, but we just kind of.

Charuka (08:11.186)
Imagine.

Sarah Walsh (08:31.147)
You know, I think we have like over 5,000 sales at this point, which is like a drop in the bucket compared to some shops. but I just, it needs to grow organically and slow for me to be able to handle it. And that’s, you know, cause people are like, why don’t you guys do this? And why don’t you guys do that? And you should do this. And I’m like, I love all those ideas, but I know I would be absolutely miserable. Like I wouldn’t be able to do, I wouldn’t, I’d have to.

Charuka (08:43.933)
Yeah, I’m delirious.

I’m you not.

Thank you.

Charuka (08:56.745)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (08:59.821)
cut other things out, so.

Charuka (09:01.477)
Yeah. And also, think a lot of times the question becomes scaling things is not, I mean, if you found a way of, know, if you found one person, five person, then then you can look out for next 500 or 1000 or whatever. But while we do this, the question I think that keeps coming back to a lot of us as creatives is that I really feel this way. Like, you know, I’ve been in business for a long time and I’ve seen and been

Sarah Walsh (09:17.921)
Mm-hmm.

Charuka (09:31.495)
in the depths of seeing really different businesses. And when I chose to, I didn’t even intentionally start Arts2Hour’s project. But, and even, you know, as we speak now, I’m also like kind of diving my hands into a dream project that I’d always envisioned, was because Modern Maharani is like an art based brand that I want to start small, meaningful.

Sarah Walsh (09:35.585)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (09:50.238)
Ooh.

Charuka (09:58.471)
more handcrafted, not large scale. I don’t want to a thousand things, a thousand pieces, but I want to sell, let’s say 50, 100. But those will be something that I’m not feeling rushed. I’m not trying to create a brand for scale. I’m also trying to create something that fulfills my soul also, because I want to put that intention into it. And I think a lot of artists do.

Sarah Walsh (09:59.2)
Uh-huh.

Sarah Walsh (10:07.51)
Yeah, yeah.

Sarah Walsh (10:15.361)
Right.

Sarah Walsh (10:22.477)
Yes, yeah. well, and I don’t wanna, yeah, I think the intention is huge and that sounds really exciting by the way, the project. I don’t wanna bash anyone who scales up in his, like honestly, is a, it’s always a goal, but I know,

Charuka (10:41.072)
Yeah, absolutely. But it’s a choice you have to make in order to

Sarah Walsh (10:49.057)
I’m just not ready to let other things go. there’s things that I’ve been like one of the things I’ve been working on, like books just take a lot of time. And I know I’d have to, if I were to put more effort into our tiger sheep shop and like scale up, I think I’d have to kind of pull back from, you know, bookmaking. And one of my goals I’ve had forever is to do more writing and illustrating books. And so,

Charuka (10:51.455)
Go ahead.

Charuka (11:16.987)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (11:19.489)
that takes time and that also takes like a slowness, a pace, a slower pace. And I knew, you know, like seven years ago, I wasn’t ready. Like I just knew, I was like, you are not, you don’t have the right mentality yet to even like approach this. So I tried to, once I was aware of that, that was helpful because then I could sort of.

Charuka (11:24.433)
Yeah. Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (11:45.038)
step back and observe myself in a way of like, well, okay, what do I need to do to like prime this surface so that I can receive this next phase of my career? so it took some time to get there and then I’m still, you know, not.

I don’t want to ever really arrive, but as far as this like goal, I’m not where I, I’m not like a published author illustrator yet, but I have learned so much and I’m very grateful to just be where I am right now. Yeah. And so I’m hoping. thank you so much. Thank you.

Charuka (12:16.925)
much. You value up. Yeah.

some really cool work.

Sarah Walsh (12:30.859)
Yeah, I just want to get more of my weird ideas out there and more of my

Charuka (12:30.876)
Yeah, so you go.

Charuka (12:35.321)
Yeah, I think that’s such a big driving force for most of us, isn’t it?

Sarah Walsh (12:40.331)
Yeah, and more personal, think more creative autonomy and more, just a little like more vulnerable, which is scary, but I think it’s more rewarding. And the longer you do this kind of work, you really do need it to mean, needs to mean something. And even though it’s commercial, I don’t, I really disagree with the idea that, you know, it doesn’t.

Charuka (13:02.427)
Hmm.

Sarah Walsh (13:10.253)
work can be meaningful. Yeah, it’s just providing art in an affordable way is kind of how I look at it. think everybody should be able to enjoy beautiful things, whether they mean something or they’re just fun or they’re just beautiful. It doesn’t have to have like a deep meaning. It can just be something beautiful.

Charuka (13:12.828)
Absolutely, yeah.

Charuka (13:19.206)
Yeah.

Charuka (13:31.066)
And I think.

Something, you know, we, I think the way art would also put it, puts everything on a pedestal to, I don’t know why. you know, I think there’s so much beauty in the idea that what is important to you and meaningful for you would be very different from what is important and meaningful to me. Let’s say, I’ll give you a very simple example. Let’s I am very sensitive towards things.

Sarah Walsh (13:55.82)
Mm-hmm.

Charuka (14:04.135)
You know, I lost my mom, right? I look at anything that has something to do with, you know, that really reminds me of those textures. If I see a drawing of a little girl or something, and these have become really special moments for me. Like when I look at it, it’s just even in a diary, I would buy a book, I would buy a diary, I would do things like that just to, you know,

Sarah Walsh (14:09.629)
Hmm. Sorry.

Sarah Walsh (14:30.721)
Yeah.

Charuka (14:32.431)
just to capture that moment and I respond to that emotion. yeah and it’s like it means something to me even if it’s you I now I look at how closely I observe these feelings or I love animals, I love animals, I love my dogs, I love dogs in general. Anything to do with dogs, I love books, I can’t buy a painting but I don’t even know if I want to do that.

Sarah Walsh (14:34.935)
then keep her with you.

Sarah Walsh (14:48.706)
Me too.

Charuka (14:59.194)
like by a painting of a dog because I mean the way I would put it, very different. But like, you know, I would collect a small postcards, a book, stickers, anywhere and everywhere, even a newspaper clipping if there’s like a doodle on the newspaper that has dogs and stuff, and I would just respond to it. So I think for a lot of people, it may be a very surface thing. But when I’m looking at it, I’m responding out of love and I feel like,

Sarah Walsh (15:04.909)
Mm-hmm.

Charuka (15:27.67)
When I see dogs in those spaces, feel like they’re being seen, like, you know, they’re getting recognized. And I think that’s very important to me. So I think there’s also it’s, you know, when it said like, you know, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder. A lot of meaning is what we give meaning to things. know, it can an expensive thing does not have to mean doesn’t say necessarily it has more depth versus something that’s

Sarah Walsh (15:33.195)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (15:46.155)
Yes.

Sarah Walsh (15:56.845)
Yeah.

Charuka (15:57.166)
more approachable, made for masses, it could also have the same depth or that depth actually depends on the person who’s viewing it as much as the person who’s making it. I think it’s a two-way conversation.

Sarah Walsh (16:07.699)
Yeah, I agree with that and I love, I wanna jump all over that because I feel like there’s a lot of like, sometimes people doubt whether they should share. That vulnerability is really, really scary. And I think when you love something, like you love dogs.

Charuka (16:28.379)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (16:35.169)
You know, I love animals as well. Like I just, I’ve loved them for a long time since I was a little kid. I just, I think they’re so magic. They’re magical. And horses is something I’ve always loved. And, but I didn’t grow up with them. You know, I experienced, my grandfather had horses and I rode them a couple of times. One of them named Big Red and it just made her, it made a real,

Charuka (16:43.898)
Yeah.

Charuka (16:49.138)
wow.

Sarah Walsh (17:03.969)
deep impression on me. And, but for the longest time, like as I got older, I kind of, always loved them, but I didn’t like put that front and center. And I think, you know, by, I wrote this little zine about how horses have kind of helped me through some difficult times and helped me, you know, I think growing up,

was really scary to me. Like the idea of growing up was terrifying to me for various reasons we probably don’t have time to get into. But I loved horses and it sort of like got me through.

What happened?

disappeared.

Sarah Walsh (19:35.553)
That’s okay. I was like, where’d she go?

Charuka (19:39.647)
I don’t know what happened. It said it just pushed me out and said, you know, I had a bad ink problem. Am I?

Sarah Walsh (19:43.958)
You’re you’re a lot clearer now. It what the picture was breaking up a little so I’m wondering if it was just you know anyway I don’t know what we’re I wanted to say I’m trying to think I don’t want to make this like an editing nightmare

Charuka (19:53.982)
You can see me better.

Charuka (20:08.531)
You can start from again and then we’ll try to take one part of it.

Sarah Walsh (20:12.991)
Okay, well, you said something, I love animals too, and we’re talking about sharing, I think when you, I know what it is. I wrote this little zine about how much I love horses and how much it helped me as a kid just get through some difficult times and helped with my fear of not wanting to grow up and just some family stuff and…

Charuka (20:14.045)
You love an

Sarah Walsh (20:40.961)
Basically, I think that when you love something as a kid, it puts like a protection spell around you, you know, as you get older, you, it sort of preserves that like soft part of you, I think. And then when you, when you grow up, a lot of people kind of squish that down and put it away. And I think things harden.

Charuka (20:59.016)
Yeah, yeah.

Charuka (21:07.471)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (21:10.165)
And I don’t know if that’s always good. I think it’s good to have things that you love and make you happy. And you’re, you’re connecting, you’re connecting with dogs. You’re connecting with animals. It’s like a connection and it’s like a lifeline. But if you’re cut off and you don’t love anything, I don’t know what that’s like. I can’t imagine anyone that’s like that, but I think we, sort of don’t under, I think.

Charuka (21:16.54)
Yeah.

Charuka (21:24.274)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (21:36.063)
the value of what we love and what resonates with us. don’t know if we really like, think sometimes we take it for granted how important it is and sharing that because then other people are like, you like that, I like that. And then, you know, it’s kind of.

Charuka (21:43.857)
Yeah.

Charuka (21:50.896)
I like it too. You bind people together.

Sarah Walsh (21:57.769)
God.

Charuka (21:57.906)
They become connections. Can’t you, you can’t hear me?

Sarah Walsh (22:00.622)
Why would she did that? No, I just had my Siri like pop up for some reason. I don’t know. I can hear you. You couldn’t hear my Siri on my computer just popped up. I don’t know why.

Charuka (22:10.679)
okay, perfect.

Charuka (22:17.018)
No, I couldn’t hear a thing. tell me something. What was, know, in every artist’s life, or not even artist specifically, in our own personal lives also, there are moments that, like, you we call them breakthrough moments. And I think you’ve had, you know, a lot of experience, you’ve done a lot of things. And as an artist, saying, you know, finding different kinds of expressions as a creative and then…

Sarah Walsh (22:19.073)
Okay. Okay, good.

Charuka (22:46.255)
also experimenting and slowly diving your hands into different and I think not only that but also see you’ve seen a lot of transitions on how things were happening now how like you know a lot of different time and spaces what what would you define as your breakthrough moment internally something really that opened up your mind or the way you were doing things for got you through got you through further like I’ll say first let’s say

For me, think one of the biggest breakthrough moments has been when I felt like I realized with Arts2Huts also, or like even my own practice, like there is so much of power in starting small and being consistent. I think in a lot of ways when I started Arts2Huts, I had no intent. I would just show up like I did today, like I told you, know. A lot of times when I’m not even feeling, I know that if it’s important, I will show up.

Sarah Walsh (23:30.647)
Mm-hmm.

Charuka (23:43.823)
That’s the least I can do. And it really opened a lot of doors for me and know, the things we’ve heard. So I want to hear from you in your own creative journey. What have been those breakthrough moments? Some, you know, that opened those doors for you, let go of the fears you had or something. I mean, I’m I’m I want to listen.

Sarah Walsh (23:45.547)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (24:05.195)
I’ve had, I mean, I’ve had, I’ve had a cup. mean, I’ve probably had like a handful, but I’d say I, I definitely want to agree with you on the baby steps. because I think change or like moving the needle comes from small incremental things. And that’s not sexy to a lot of people. want these grandiose gestures and these huge monumental movements that like,

Charuka (24:31.824)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (24:34.943)
Everything’s different now and it just doesn’t work like that. I think you build something like you said you decided to just say okay from now on I’m just gonna show up as I am whether I’m at my best or whatever I’m just gonna show up. It’s the least I can do like I love that and so I think for me sort of similar to that way with trying to figure out writing and illustrating I’ve

Charuka (24:39.13)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (25:03.455)
always collected zines and I always I just thought they were the coolest thing. I’ve loved them for a long time and some people don’t know what they are and hopefully everyone does but in case someone listening doesn’t they’re just little mini books that anyone can publish like a self-published book and so I think writing is something I was put on a pedestal and so

in order to make it less intimidating and just kind of a way for me to try out and experiment my illustration style with writing and more narrative, just making little books for just for pleasure, for enjoyment, for experimentation, for just for no reason other than that. They don’t need a reason to exist other than themselves.

Charuka (25:40.772)
you

Charuka (26:01.97)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (26:04.157)
And so that has been just a huge, huge breakthrough for me to just one, have a lot of fun and to grow without pressure and in a way that feels good to me and in a way that feels sustainable and like it’s something I can just keep building on. So.

Charuka (26:13.22)
you

Sarah Walsh (26:31.885)
Yeah, I can’t say enough about just like low bar baby step smaller versions of the big thing Just it’s not dramatic. It’s really not it’s about like small small things Yeah

Charuka (26:44.966)
Yeah.

Yeah. Okay. What were your biggest fears if you were, if you look back? What do you think were your biggest fears that you either have them today also or you kind of dealt with them?

Sarah Walsh (27:02.751)
I think, well, I’m working on a graphic. I have one right now that’s kind of ridiculous, but I’m working on a graphic novel manuscript that we don’t, I don’t have a publisher yet, but I feel like I’m like, I, I’m like, mm hmm. Yeah. I’m writing it. Yeah. And I don’t know where it’s going to go.

Charuka (27:05.572)
Because yeah, I’m sure you must have. Okay.

Charuka (27:19.778)
And you’re writing one too. You’re the one writing it also and illustrating.

Sarah Walsh (27:28.909)
And most people don’t even talk about this when they’re, you it’s like, it’s weird to even say it because a lot of people keep this secret, but I’m kind of an open book and I’m excited about it and I’ve worked really hard. I’m not going to not talk about it. Wherever this ends up, it’s I’m learning a lot, but I feel like I’m like, I better not die before I finish this. I’ve worked so hard on it and it’s just meant so much to me and I’ve cried so much while writing it and laughed and like,

Charuka (27:31.544)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (27:58.87)
It’s been something that’s like turned me inside out and I have like 30 pages left and I’m just, it’s like a 200 page manuscript and so I’m like, I’ve never done anything like that in my life and I just, I’m like superstitious so I’m gonna get like hit by a bus before I finish.

Charuka (28:04.388)
my goodness.

Charuka (28:19.317)
Look at our minds like really, like the stories we tell ourselves.

Sarah Walsh (28:19.917)
I know, it’s crazy. But I think as far as just in general, I don’t know. I have a lot of fears, but I think…

Charuka (28:26.103)
Yeah.

Charuka (28:38.817)
You had, I think, let’s talk about how a few that you had and then what happened and what did you do for them to overcome.

Sarah Walsh (28:44.087)
I think.

Well, I think when I was in college, I think this is probably a common fear of just like, how do I go from being in school, being in art school, and then getting a job and then showing up consistently and then making the art under pressure with a deadline and then doing it over and over again? That is so unknown.

when you’re in college and I was a single mom at the time. So I was juggling parenting and going to college and I was waitressing. So I had a lot on my plate and I was like, okay, so after this is over, I have to get a job and do this. So I had a lot of anxiety. But I think one thing that helps me with my fears is humor and

Charuka (29:27.038)
like

Sarah Walsh (29:45.644)
you know, self-deprecation and just not taking, I take what I do seriously, but I don’t, I try not to take myself too seriously. I mean, I can get serious when I’m talking about something, but I think, you know, we get in our heads a lot. So I did get a job thankfully right after college and I got a job as a greeting card artist at Home Art Cards and worked.

Charuka (29:53.089)
That’s so sweet.

Charuka (30:01.293)
Yeah.

Charuka (30:08.502)
wow! How lovely would that job be? Am I right? Did you enjoy that job?

Sarah Walsh (30:14.047)
It was pretty wonderful. mean, a lot of people say it’s kind of like getting paid to get your graduate degree because you learn. Now I don’t know how it is now because a lot of people don’t work in the office, but there was a very golden time of learning from all the artists around you. it was, I’ve met my favorite people in the world, almost, not everybody, but I’ve met

Charuka (30:24.949)
We learn so much.

Charuka (30:36.34)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (30:43.199)
a lot of wonderful, wonderful people there because a lot of the people they hired, you know, this is in Kansas City, Missouri, in the States. And so they would hire people though from like all over. So we were all sort of transplants because I grew up in upstate New York. But yeah, I was like, I got to learn. that’s where I want one of my creative puzzle pieces was definitely

finding the work or discovering, not discovering, but just coming across the work of Mary Blair. she was like a huge puzzle piece for me. a coworker named Kathy had the, can fly book on displayed on her desk. And I walked by and I was like, what is that? I immediately like be aligned over because I had never really seen, you know, mid century.

Charuka (31:31.394)
Okay.

Sarah Walsh (31:41.676)
children’s book art for some reason up until that point I had not been exposed to that graphic gouache style of painting really that was very like reduced and very mid-century and and I just fell in love with it immediately and then I had been very digital up until that point doing Photoshop and Illustrator and I just I it was Mary Blair and then it was Alice and Martin Robinson and

Charuka (31:51.753)
Hmm.

Charuka (31:56.211)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (32:11.309)
just all these mid-century children’s book illustrators and they all use the medium gouache. And I was like, I want to learn how to paint like this. I self-taught, like I went to school for graphic design. I didn’t even go for illustration. But yeah, so I wanted to learn that. so I, yeah, I was there for like 13 years kind of honing my illustration, yeah.

Charuka (32:18.811)
I love God.

Charuka (32:22.944)
Yeah.

Charuka (32:35.353)
Wow!

Charuka (32:39.969)
That’s a long long time. A lot of time. Wow.

Sarah Walsh (32:40.301)
It is a long, time. Yes, it is. Yeah. And now I’ve, sorry, go ahead.

Charuka (32:48.32)
You know, but what? Isn’t it a fortune? a lot. I’m just saying, you know, isn’t it such a big blessing because a lot of people struggle to even find a job that can that can pay them to paint like, you know, lot of arts people who graduate from all different courses, they have to pick up a lot of different jobs, teaching and stuff. like teaching is still, you know, still connected to that or completely.

Sarah Walsh (33:01.728)
I know.

Sarah Walsh (33:10.625)
Yes.

Yes. Yes.

Yes.

Charuka (33:17.994)
completely off the books because you know we all have to pay our bills, we have to make a living and it’s not as easy. But you being able to get that kind of a platform very early on and then sticking through it, I’m sure like it’s

Sarah Walsh (33:22.369)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (33:29.037)
I know. You’re not wrong. I think about it every once in a while. I will always think about that idea of being able to experience.

just showing up every day and being creative and being with other creatives. It’s very much like a bubble. And I know it’s definitely not lost on me that, you know, a lot of people will never get to experience that. And it was hard to walk away from that. Actually, a lot of people stay forever. They’ll stay 20, 30 years. And I just I just didn’t I couldn’t do that.

Charuka (34:03.07)
Yeah.

Charuka (34:09.512)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (34:15.233)
but my husband works there now. It’s changed a lot. He’s also an illustrator. So, but yeah, it definitely like filled my cup and taught me so much. And I will always be so grateful of that experience. And I feel like it gave me so much to kind of work with as I kind of went on to the next phase of

Charuka (34:18.947)
wow.

Charuka (34:43.839)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (34:45.107)
my career as a freelance illustrator.

Charuka (34:50.373)
it starting out as a freelance? Was it not daunting? Like also the kind of skills you would need not as an illustrator because I’m sure 13 years you would be heck of an illustrator working like you’ve learned and you know done a lot of groundwork but then starting off as a freelancer I think it’s so hard it’s incredibly hard because you often don’t have a clue I don’t know if you’re

Sarah Walsh (35:15.041)
Yes.

Charuka (35:18.61)
where you were working, did you have exposure to working with clients or like stuff like that. But then finding clients.

Sarah Walsh (35:22.509)
It can be very scary. Yeah, it can. Yeah, it can be. I don’t I don’t feel like.

I have like the most typical experience starting out. I was really fortunate. I feel like I got my butt kicked the first half of my life and then I woke up and started doing right by myself and then the universe was just like this the whole time after that. It was like that because I feel really lucky. It was like I got a rep. I was interested in this rep.

Charuka (35:49.897)
They exist, yeah.

Sarah Walsh (36:03.065)
Her name is Lola Rogers. She’s retired now, very amazing lady. She, I had idolized her and her artists for a long time and would like go on the internet and like make Photoshop Pinterest boards, basically, you know, before Pinterest was a thing, I would like drag JPEGs and like, this is so cool, you know? And so

Charuka (36:05.914)
yeah, I love a word.

Sarah Walsh (36:27.021)
I would idolize her stuff and I started getting really itchy at homework and I was like, I don’t know. just, had an Etsy, I had a blog. I just, I wanted to see what else was out there. And I, this at a corporation as amazing as it was, there’s a lot of politics and it started to kind of affect my spirit. I was like, not, I wasn’t happy and I felt like I could make a go of it. And so a friend of mine, she was like, you should apply.

Charuka (36:43.239)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (36:56.011)
to Lilla and I was like, I feel like I have a better chance of getting on the moon. Like it felt like very impossible. And then I submitted my work and I honestly still, felt like, whoa, it felt like winning the lottery. and I was pregnant at the time. And so I was like, when I got the representation, there’s some, some rules, like when you work at a corporate, you know, there’s like the no comp.

that no compete and stuff like that. And so I was like, well, I feel like if I don’t quit and figure, give it a go, like it’s going to be really complicated. Plus with a newborn and all this stuff. And so my husband was super supportive. He was like, you gotta, you gotta see this through. You’re, going to regret this. If you don’t take the plunge, we’ll be okay. But it was really terrifying because our daughter was going into college. So we had college tuition to figure out.

Charuka (37:25.487)
Yeah. Yeah.

Charuka (37:45.477)
Don’t do it. Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (37:54.328)
we had a newborn on the way, I think a lot of people would not have quit. Like I think about it now and I’m like, I can’t believe I did that. And I’m so grateful that my partner was so supportive because that’s kind of a big part of it. If your partner isn’t on board, it’s like, it’s no go and it causes problems. One person wants to do this. And so big shout out to Colin. But like,

Charuka (38:06.184)
support.

Mm-hmm.

Charuka (38:12.669)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (38:20.747)
Yeah. So I took the plunge and though, I started my business and I had a newborn and no daycare and it was kind of a hot mess for a while. And then I eventually got like daycare a couple of days a week, but I was working like during naps and it was, it was really stressful, but it was very exciting. And, yeah. So it was, I think I went off a little on a tangent. I hope I answered your question. Okay.

Charuka (38:41.435)
Hmm.

Charuka (38:47.987)
Now I know there’s no wrong way to go.

Sarah Walsh (38:50.797)
Okay, all right. It feels like a thousand years ago. It’s like a different lifetime. Cause now I’ve been freelancing for like, as long as my son’s been alive and he’s about to turn 12, September 13th. So yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep.

Charuka (39:04.158)
Wow! What’s your tip for somebody who’s…

who wants to, let’s say, freelance in a way to get more opportunities, take their art out there. Specifically, I feel like, you know, I’ve seen this difference because I’ve also been myself through different journeys. I started as a graphic designer. I worked as a graphic designer. And then I transitioned with, you know, working digital and I wanted to go into the arts and I was pretty good with drawing since the beginning.

Sarah Walsh (39:29.422)
Okay.

Charuka (39:40.689)
felt very easy for me so I started working on the iPad and very much like you ever since I was introduced to gouache I fell in love with it it’s still one of the best mediums that it’s that’s the only medium I use even today like I don’t know

Sarah Walsh (39:42.775)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (39:52.077)
Ugh.

Sarah Walsh (39:58.254)
Do you do acrylic wash or water based or both?

Charuka (40:01.309)
I do water-based gouache. And I love how early they are. I’m a very early person. So they really speak to me in a sense because, and they’re very, very forgiving. They are very flexible. They give a lot of space to me. And I just feel like, know, I also have a very illustrative style, you said.

Sarah Walsh (40:09.389)
Mm-hmm.

Sarah Walsh (40:15.947)
Yes.

Charuka (40:28.485)
I’m a person who likes to go in details and I really like even though like there’s a battle between you know, larger scale work, small weight work. I really enjoy working small. Like I really like to go into the details. Yeah, and that process is also very intimate. Like when I can just sit on a table or I don’t know wherever I’m going, I can just carry it with me and I can be anywhere. And I really like that. And then I missed the tangent. What was I saying?

Sarah Walsh (40:39.085)
It’s more intimate.

Sarah Walsh (40:51.245)
Mm-hmm.

Charuka (40:58.653)
What was I saying? I don’t know where was I going?

Sarah Walsh (40:59.307)
Well…

Sarah Walsh (41:07.469)
Talk about mediums. remember the question you asked when I went on the tangent though, and I do wanna, you asked me about how to get jobs as like a freelance illustrator. I do wanna talk about that when we’re done with what you’re saying.

Charuka (41:27.42)
Yeah, so I’m and I, you know, when I went into Gouash and my style was very illustrative. So there was also a time I reached out to Lily and she responded, even though I wasn’t in for it. But I was so grateful that she responded and I done the same thing as yours, because, you know, at that time, wherever I would show my work and, know, and I was in India and India had a lot of baggage when it came to the art, like, oh, this is illustrative. This is

Sarah Walsh (41:36.077)
Thank

Sarah Walsh (41:45.345)
Yeah.

Charuka (41:56.572)
this, this is fine art, this is you know, there was so much boxes. So I felt like okay my work is maybe not fine art for art and then I maybe it’s more illustrative so maybe I should try illustrations and stuff like that. And you know, so I did those things and I think a lot of people like myself have struggled or struggled.

Sarah Walsh (42:00.044)
Yeah. Hmm. Interesting.

Sarah Walsh (42:08.257)
Mm.

Charuka (42:19.269)
with the idea that my work could fit in, like, you even if I’m a fine artist, my work fits in the category of an illustration and I could start there. But I don’t, because I’m not from that place, an industry, I don’t know how to even monetize or even, you know, how to even find work that can pay me or I can just, if I want to do some kind of work, how do I navigate?

Sarah Walsh (42:27.957)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (42:33.814)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (42:42.113)
Well, I feel like I think the important thing to start from is like what you’re passionate about. as far as I think research is huge, like researching the different markets, like say, yeah, if you want to break into the illustration world, do you like books? Do you like puzzles? Do you like food labeling? Do you like, cause I think the closer

the more you can fill in the gap of your personal, like passions to professional, you’re going to just shine more. And so I feel like when you’re, you know, for instance, like, you know, just like if I, if I’m at a bookshop and I see a book cover and I’m like, that’s so beautiful. And I, I look at who the publisher is and I make a note of like who the editor is. And I get really, I think a lot of

Charuka (43:20.129)
It gets… Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (43:40.566)
getting jobs is like detective work. when you’re, you really have to get specific and the more specific you are, you know, not to bring the universe in again, cause, but I think that if the more vague we are, we’re just like, I just want something cool to happen to me. You know, it’s just like, well, if I was the, if I was the universe, I’d be like, what do want me to do with that? Like, yeah, I need you to.

Charuka (43:43.674)
Yeah.

Charuka (43:58.575)
Yeah, it’s not gonna work.

What’s good?

Sarah Walsh (44:05.591)
Tell me exactly what you want and I need you to say it out loud. I need you to write it down. need you to because because if you are taking the time to figure out what you want down to the little tiny little speck, there’s no room for doubt. There’s no space for vagueness and the more it’s going to happen and so find out who you love.

Charuka (44:06.331)
Tell me.

Charuka (44:21.614)
Yeah.

Charuka (44:28.91)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (44:32.615)
Find out what products you like that have illustrations on it, whether it’s like a company that sells stickers. Start a tiny little shop. Just start making the things that within your means that you want to see out there that you’re passionate about, like taking the initiative to just make things happen within your means. mean, there’s also a lot of print on demand. If you don’t have any money up front, which most people don’t, you know, it’s like

Charuka (44:39.203)
Yeah.

Charuka (45:00.534)
Best.

Sarah Walsh (45:01.901)
print on demand companies, you don’t have to spend any money and you can, except for like, you know, maybe a listing fee in Etsy is like 20 cents or whatever, but you can make a whole collection without spending a dime. But I think it’s like taking the initiative and really sculpting it yourself. And as far as like reaching out to art directors and editorial directors, I think,

Charuka (45:16.314)
Thank

Sarah Walsh (45:32.064)
Sharing your work and reaching out. It’s so scary. I know to like just email someone and they don’t email back a lot of people are busy and Honestly, it has nothing. I think we like to internalize things ago they don’t like me or they do this me me me me take yourself out of it You know how other people feel about your work or about you. It’s none of your business

Charuka (45:40.011)
Yeah. Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (45:58.336)
If you like what you’re doing, that’s all that matters. So if you can email that person, keep a tab, have a little notebook and be like, emailed this art director on August 15th, check back in with her in a month. you know, it’s like, almost like lock in and go, I’m gonna be that annoying person and just email them like three times a year with a newsletter.

Charuka (46:20.876)
I was going to read that.

Sarah Walsh (46:27.137)
You know, you just, it’s a, it’s a slow game sometimes with planting seeds. You just never know where something’s going to start growing. And so whether it’s like in-person events, like art fairs or, you know, but if you’re, if you’re excited and you’re putting out good energy, like something is going to stick. just may not be exactly when you want or.

Charuka (46:29.922)
Yeah.

Charuka (46:49.315)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (46:53.291)
And if you’re busy moving on to the next thing instead of twiddling, you know, we’re twiddling our thumbs waiting, just forget about it. Put it over here, work on something else and not be fixated on that. And that’ll just kind of keep everything moving. And so that’s what I, you know, recommend on like trying to generate work when you’re slow or breaking into it. I mean, it’s definitely difficult and it’s not for everyone.

Charuka (47:05.675)
Yeah.

Charuka (47:16.201)
you

Sarah Walsh (47:21.707)
But if you’re having a good time making things at the center of it, then you can kind of deal with all that stuff.

Charuka (47:24.284)
May.

Charuka (47:28.864)
Yeah. Thank you so much, Sara. This was really wonderful. I could chat for a lot longer, but I want you to, of course, go and take rest. And I, of course, really appreciate your time. So I don’t want to take advantage of that. Thank you so much. It’s been a pleasure. think we’ll have you a couple more times to maybe get through to your learnings. I think, and I hope, and I put this out in the universe, that when

Sarah Walsh (47:33.409)
Thank you so much for having me.

Sarah Walsh (47:45.314)
Yeah.

Sarah Walsh (47:50.421)
Yeah, I’d love to be back on.

Charuka (47:58.486)
The next time we meet, we’re talking about the graphic novel and learning from your learning.

Sarah Walsh (48:01.901)
my god, that’s I just got the chills. That’s so really kind of you to say I really appreciate that and I appreciate you taking the time to speak with me. Yeah, well, we’ll see. I mean, like I said, I just I feel grateful not to be cheesy, but I do I feel really good about where I am. I’m proud. I never thought I would be able to do something like that. So whatever happens with it, whatever anybody is working on right now, like

Charuka (48:09.164)
So I really hope we make that happen.

Yes,

Charuka (48:27.584)
icon, you’ll see.

Sarah Walsh (48:31.187)
Just feel good about whatever you’re doing. If you’re putting yourself out there, it’s really hard and it’s really scary. So I hope you feel proud of that. I hope you feel better and I do hope we get to talk again sometime. Yeah.

Charuka (48:43.734)
Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. I hope you have a good day and I really appreciate your time.

Sarah Walsh (48:49.783)
Thanks.

Me too, I appreciate your time. Take care.

Charuka (48:55.597)
You too. You’ll have to stay back, sorry.

.

About the Guest(s):

Sarah Walsh is a maker of books & illustrated goods. Her passion is creating magical worlds with vivid color, thoughtful narratives, and endearing characters. Her drawings and hand lettering can be found on anything from a tote bag for Blue Q to a fully illustrated version of Roald Dahl’s classic book Matilda. Her influences are an eclectic mix of 80’s pop culture, vintage children’s books, mid-century design, and folk art. Sarah has illustrated over 20 picture books with top publishers and partnered with celebrated brands all over the world. She also makes and sells illustrated goods with her partner Colin Walsh for their online shop Tigersheep Friends. Sarah also maintains a consistent personal practice by doodling or painting in her sketchbooks. They’re a place for her to get lost, write, experiment and dream up future projects. She lives in Kansas City with her partner, son and dog.

Episode Summary:

In this conversation, Sarah Walsh, an illustrator, shares her journey in the creative industry, discussing the challenges and rewards of being a freelance artist. She emphasizes the importance of maintaining multiple income streams, the significance of personal connection in art, and the necessity of taking small, consistent steps towards achieving creative goals. Sarah also reflects on her breakthrough moments, the fears she has faced, and offers valuable advice for aspiring illustrators looking to navigate the art world.

Key Takeaways

• Sarah has been an illustrator since childhood and feels lucky to make a living from her art.
• Balancing multiple projects is essential for freelance artists to maintain income.
• Creativity must be nurtured like a well; it needs to be deep to sustain a creative business.
• Art can be both commercial and meaningful, providing joy and beauty to people.
• Incremental changes are key to making progress in a creative career.
• Taking the plunge into freelance work can be terrifying but rewarding with the right support.
• Building a freelance career requires research and understanding of the market.
• Finding your niche and passion in art can lead to greater fulfillment and success.
• Persistence in reaching out to art directors is crucial for gaining opportunities.
• Creating art that resonates personally can lead to deeper connections with audiences.

Notable Quotes:

“If you have more than one thing going on, you can pivot when work slows down, and that makes freelance life less scary.”

“Zines were my way of learning to write and illustrate without pressure — small steps that made the big goal less overwhelming.”

“How other people feel about your work isn’t your business. If you like what you’re doing, that’s what matters.”

“I know I could scale up my shop, but I’d have to give up books — and books are where I want to put my time.

Charuka Arora is the founder of the Arts to Hearts Project and Host of the Arts to Hearts Podcast. She is also an acclaimed Indian artist known for her contemporary embellished paintings. Her unique blend of gouache, collage, embroidery, painting, and drawing explores the intersection of art, culture, heritage, and womanhood. Through her work, she tells stories of female strength and encapsulates them in pieces that can be treasured for generations.

Charuka’s work draws inspiration from Hindu mythology, recognizing women as vessels of Shakti, the cosmic energy. She beautifully portrays powerful goddesses like Durga Maa riding a tiger or lion, symbolizing their unlimited power to protect virtue and combat evil.

Through her art, Charuka invites us into the world of women, showcasing their beauty, strength, and resilience. Her creations not only exhibit exceptional talent but also serve as an inspiration and a symbol of hope for those challenging societal norms.

Arts to Hearts Podcast is a show delving into the lives and passions of renowned artists. From running creative businesses and studio art practices to cultivating a successful mindset, Charuka Arora engages in heartfelt conversations with her guests. Experience your personal happy hour with your favorite artists right in your studio.

Through candid discussions, Charuka and her guests reveal the joys and challenges of a vibrant creative life, both within and beyond our studios. Get ready to be inspired and uplifted as you tune in.