S2EP75. How she built her ‘SIX-FIGURE’ Art & design Business w/ Alli Koch, Artist & Creative Entrepreneur

A lli Koch founded AlliKDesign in 2014. A custom artist based in Dallas, TX, Alli has turned her passion for art and design into a full-time career. The author of 2 published books, How to Draw Modern Florals and Florals by Hand, Alli is on a mission to inspire others to create. You can find Alli’s artwork on murals all around Dallas-Forth Worth and throughout the U.S., as well as merchandise in stores all around the country.

When she isn’t designing artwork, Alli speaks about business and entrepreneurship on panels or her podcast, Breakfast with Sis, recorded with her dad every Saturday morning. While Alli has been able to work with some great companies and created things that have been nationally recognized, her favorite part of her job is still drawing from her bed while cuddling with her cats and drinking a Chick-Fil-a sweet tea.

Follow Alli:

Charuka Arora, Founder of Arts To Hearts Project

www.charukaarora.com

Arts To Hearts Project

https://artstoheartsproject.com/

www.instagram.com/artstoheartsproject/

AUTOMATED TRANSCRIPTS

00:00.00
charukaarora
Hey, you guys welcome back to the arts two hearts podcast this is season 2 and I’m your host charka today I have an amazing amazing artist from again another corner of the world. Someone who is really popular on the internet very large and. So much so much amazing. Um, experiences to share with us I have Ali K on the podcast who’s widely popular in the internet I’ve had the pleasure to speak to her in 1 of her early sessions in community at queens and. I was so mesmerized with her her honesty how she really share her story and I really wanted to bring her on the podcast today. So welcome to the podcast. Sally how are you.

00:47.30
alli koch
Hello. Thank you so much for having me How are you.

00:53.14
charukaarora
I’m good. Thank you so much Allie I remember um our session in the art queens and that’s where I actually make you for the first time I knew before about you before that. But it was so so nice because we had such a nice session. You were so honest, you shared a lot about your work your own journey things like that. Um, but before we go into any of that can you for anyone who doesn’t know you or anyone just to introduce yourself who you are what you do. Would you like to introduce your self on the podcast ones.

01:28.68
alli koch
Yes, so I am Allie K I live in Dallas Texas born and raised on a southern gal. Ah so it’s um, sorry.

01:46.14
charukaarora
Ah, so at course that’s okay, we can get another cut.

01:46.31
alli koch
Um, it’s.

01:51.27
alli koch
It’s right? Yeah I was gonna say like I forgot to ask you do you cut these or do you is it all 1 live. Okay, perfect perfect I was like hold on do I need to make sure that I got sidetracked because it’s like oh no I forgot to ask her okay I’ll start over.

01:53.41
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah, we do it? No no.

02:00.67
charukaarora
Yeah, no. Click. Yeah.

02:07.61
alli koch
Now I know all right? Yes I am aie k I live in Dallas Texas and I am a full time artist I kind of do a little bit of everything. I started off actually painting canvases and globes out of my kitchen apartment and it kind of grew into I mean I started off as what I thought was going to be a hobby and my husband even was like oh. This is a cute hobby like you need to get a job but then I started selling my artwork and my friends were paying for them and ah yeah, I’m such a giver and so I was like oh no no, no you don’t have to pay and like no like this is your this is a business I’m like is it and they’re like yes it is and so they started paying me. Um, so I definitely thank all of my friends that who supported me at the very beginning and they really pushed me to be like okay this is a business and so I started my business painting cameravases and gloves and I was like okay how do I prove to myself and to my family and to everyone. That I am like a true business and I knew that I couldn’t sustain what I was doing with just like making little cards and canvases like that is you would have to sell so many do wholesale something like that I just didn’t know that world back then that was seven years ago when I started. So.

03:25.83
charukaarora
Um.

03:36.65
alli koch
So hey I’m gonna get into the wedding industry I had just gotten married I know that there’s so much money into wedding and imitations I was like I’m going to start that so I started doing calligraphy and wedding signs and I really was known for that in Dallas. Which was really great and that’s where I really learned how to network too was within the wedding industry I really realized that I wasn’t networking to brides I was mostly networking to the other wedding industry.

04:07.89
charukaarora
Yeah.

04:09.96
alli koch
Companies. So like the florist the photographers, the wedding planners things like that and that’s my business just skyrocketed when I realized that that was the key to networking versus trying to focus on the brides. So I did that for.

04:17.17
charukaarora
Oh wow.

04:27.61
alli koch
A couple years and I so grew out of my kitchen apartment. So I moved into a studio and as a studio. Ah we have a thing called Craigslist here I don’t know if that’s not like worldwide but it’s essentially like an e ebay or whatnot. But for.

04:30.93
charukaarora
Oh well. Yeah, Union. Yeah.

04:45.91
alli koch
Anything and everything so I have found my first studio off of Craigslist. It was ratty and I was like my husband was like I don’t know about this I’m like no no, no it just needs a good good white paint and they’ll will make it. We’ll make it work so I painted it I asked my landlord like hey can I paint a mural on this.

04:56.34
charukaarora
Um, this is.

05:04.52
alli koch
Wall and they’re he’s like yeah like this is your spaceac. You can do whatever and I was like awesome. So I painted my very first mirroral I had no idea it was doing I think I painted it in sharpie like didn’t even use like to erect paint I was just like okay we’ll just paint this up on the wall and it was kind of. Like weird like taboo because you’ve always been told like don’t paint don’t write on the walls like don’t do that so it was a weird feeling of like okay I’m just gonna write on this wall but I did and I posted on social media and very very long story short now I’ve painted over a hundred murals all throughout the Us.

05:22.15
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

05:34.30
charukaarora
So vow.

05:37.98
alli koch
And have now grown my business into a 6 figure a 6 figure art business which is really great and just love to be able to share the story that there is no such thing as starving artist because that’s what I grew up with and through the early years of my career when I was like oh yeah, um. And artist I would still kind of get that like oh you’re an artist like oh you’re relying on like your husband’s income or oh you’re you’re one of those starving artists and not doing anything but I love to be able to kind of break that stereotype and be like yeah I’m an artist and I make.

05:59.83
charukaarora
Um, ah things. Oh wow.

06:12.30
charukaarora
You know I went in 6 they go business.

06:16.77
alli koch
Yes, yeah I make more money than my husband. So it’s a great.

06:19.87
charukaarora
Ah, that’s so amazing and so inspiring I mean like you made it sound easy. But I’m sure it was in that that’s swift and smooth. But before we go into that tell me something.

06:29.39
alli koch
Yes.

06:34.62
charukaarora
Before like in the beginning of the story you mentioned from the point where you just started it as a hobby. What were you doing before that were you anywhere interested in the arts like in Jewelling drawing or like you know why? you the artsy kit before that.

06:40.76
alli koch
Oh no.

06:49.80
alli koch
Yan so before that I had dress graduated college. So I graduated with a marketing degree from u and t it’s a college here in Texas and.

06:55.84
charukaarora
Oh wow.

07:02.91
alli koch
I could not find a job whatsoever. It was kind of like the hunger games when I graduated like all my classmates were going out for the same jobs and I at the time just like didn’t have enough experience within the marketing I always kind of took the I’m going to be a nanny route or I. Turned at a mom and pop shop that I’ve grown up with um and I helped them so it wasn’t a like I never worked in the corporate world ever which is really weird to think about but because I didn’t have that corporate world Experience. It was hard for me to get a corporate job and at the time.

07:29.38
charukaarora
Yeah.

07:37.48
charukaarora
Jump.

07:40.53
alli koch
I was really defeated I was like oh my gosh. What’s wrong with me like if the people would just give me a chance I know I’m so great at this like they don’t know what they’re missing and I was just not looking back as like I now know why I didn’t get those jobs because I wasn’t made to.

07:54.55
charukaarora
Why this me? yeah, do think like your experience and your degree in the marketing. Um also made it quite possible for you to label life like this to be self-employed.

07:59.32
alli koch
Work for someone else I was made to work for myself. So.

08:14.37
charukaarora
To grow your business because it’s It’s a lot of effort of promotion and putting yourself out there.

08:19.11
alli koch
It is and there was 1 year where I came to my parents and like I’m so sorry like I’m not using my marketing degree like you spent so much money for me to go to college and and I don’t have a marketing job and they’re like what are you talking about like you market yourself every single day.

08:34.65
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

08:36.98
alli koch
Like yeah I guess like subconsciously I do that but I’m not like using like I never made like a business plan or a marketing strategy like all like the really textbook stuff that I learned in college I feel like I don’t really use. There was one class though that I had to take. And it was how to create a website and I was like this is so dumb I’m never gonna have to create a website and I like I had a good friend and he was super sorry the dogs are on Bark I’ll just wait.

09:11.21
charukaarora
Now problem.

09:15.33
alli koch
Um, all just have to wait sorryrinkly stop.

09:19.36
charukaarora
It’s okay.

09:24.91
charukaarora
Know done.

09:25.39
alli koch
Sorry um, I’ll start with like I had to take 1 class so you can like cut it easily. They’re gonna bark again I’m just waiting for them to come into the house brikly stop I have 2 but my husband’s about to walk into the door open the door.

09:31.18
charukaarora
Yes.

09:36.91
charukaarora
How many are they so row.

09:45.32
alli koch
Oh the door is locked on. Sorry.

09:47.16
charukaarora
No problem.

09:51.31
alli koch
Be nice.

10:01.35
alli koch
Okay, there shouldn’t be any more distractions this tonight he’s home. He’s got the dogs. He’s fine. Okay, so I’ll start with like I hug one class I had one class in college that was.

10:04.26
charukaarora
Um, okay yeah.

10:17.23
alli koch
About how to build a website and I was like this is so silly I’m never gonna have to build a website like this is pointless and so I had a really good friend that I had a really good friend that was taken the class with me. She was really great at that stuff and so she helped me a ton through that. But now I wish that I would have actually paid attention in that class because I actually do build websites now. Well I build my own website so not like anything. It’s like Squarespace.

10:43.11
charukaarora
Um, wow you do So yeah.

10:52.45
alli koch
Things like that. But I’m like oh man I could have done something way cooler if I would have paid attention in in that class but jokes on me.

10:55.45
charukaarora
Ah, but you know I just I always think like it. Also I think it’s so long times It’s just not the direct build but also subconsciously we whatever whatever part of degree. Let’s say learning that we teach at that point.

11:11.24
alli koch
To his.

11:13.32
charukaarora
Even if we are directly not consuming that knowledge. But we’re always subconsciously consuming that knowledge.

11:17.93
alli koch
Oh for sure and I think with college I Definitely learned skills of networking and how to um, figure out like who who are the good classmates to work with in class and who are not and I use those skills outside of outside of college too. So. Um, just so the social aspect of it was really great and I definitely took that outside of college and within my career.

11:43.70
charukaarora
So lovely So you’ve never been to an art school right.

11:49.22
alli koch
So I say that so I graduated with marketing but I started off my college career as an interior design student and so being an interior design student. You had to take like art 1 art history.

12:00.41
charukaarora
So loud.

12:07.63
alli koch
Ah, color theory things like that. So I have ah technically a minor in art but nothing that is just like I don’t have an art degree type of thing but definitely a minor very basic stuff. Yes.

12:17.33
charukaarora
Lovely. But you’re all you. You’re like a graduate in interior design.

12:23.92
alli koch
No, so I started off an interior design and I got cold feet as like I’m not gonna be able to get a job I need a business degree things like that. So I switched it to marketing. Yes, yes yeah.

12:28.97
charukaarora
Oh. Oh So in the beginning you were there for a while. Oh now Now if you connect the dots. It makes so much more sense. Okay, so you a lot of that you’ve done to relax you not only someone who’s um.

12:42.57
alli koch
Yes, yes yeah.

12:54.70
charukaarora
Murals is also written books. It’s it’s It’s such a nice and inspiring example to see for a lot of people who think they need to come from a certain um background or a certain degree or a certain something.

13:08.20
alli koch
And who.

13:13.49
charukaarora
Know like to be here or to do all of this will you share your journey about when like how did this pan out for you. A lot of work that you’re doing today. You’ve you done like neural po. You do so many other projects can you talk a little bit about your journey about of.

13:33.45
alli koch
Yeah, so it definitely was a process I know it seems like social media is definitely like just the highlight real. But there’s a lot that goes in it on the on the back end. But if you just kind of like scroll through my social media. She’s like Wow this girl has done so much in such a short period of time and it kind of.

13:33.47
charukaarora
Reading here.

13:38.11
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

13:51.54
alli koch
Does seem like it. It doesn’t seem like it’s been 7 years um that I’ve been in business but it’s definitely evolved so much and it’s just like me being open and me being open for opportunities and and not being too focused on 1 thing to be able to.

13:55.66
charukaarora
Yeah.

14:09.30
alli koch
Do other things. Um I think a lot of people. Ah I think a lot of people try to like everyone is like go find your niche find your ni find your niche and that’s great at some points of like finding your brand and like who your brand is going to be but as far as like opportunities and stuff like don’t put yourself in a box like. Like oh I only paint murals or oh I only do this and I’m like well I can also write how to draw books and I can also have an online shop and I can also have a podcast and I can also like help other creatives build confidence I can I can and I want to do all these other things and. We shouldn’t limit ourselves to only doing 1 aspect of art. We can do like so for me like I’m mostly known for my black and white artwork and so like I’m always constantly like okay this is kind of like my brand this is me this is like who i.

14:54.55
charukaarora
Yeah, yeah.

15:03.73
alli koch
Am so like what can I use this black and my artwork for and what can I put it on and just trying to like push myself creatively that way.

15:13.15
charukaarora
Amazing. So when you’re talking about the black and white Artworks Let’s also talk about how you found your style which has become quite iconic for who you are today. Were you. Like were you around this were you very different. How was it like.

15:30.16
alli koch
Yeah, so that also evolved I did not start off I was a lot of like pink and glitter and gold and all this stuff and that’s what was really trendy at the time when I first graduated high school or sorry. When I first graduated college I was looking at hobby lobby and all these signs I’m like oh I can I can make that and so that’s that’s what I did and so that was really in at the moment but during those like first couple of years outside of college.

15:50.53
charukaarora
Khali.

16:08.72
alli koch
I was by myself a lot. My friends all had 9 to 5 jobs I hadn’t had had a 9 to 5 job and so it was just me and my cat and I really got to know who I was my wardrobe changed I wasn’t because I think like.

16:16.58
charukaarora
Hi.

16:24.97
alli koch
When you’re around other people. You definitely tend to ah attract what they’re wearing or what they’re doing and things like that and so when I wasn’t and it was just me I started to really find myself in what I personally liked and I found my style.

16:25.60
charukaarora
You get. Yeah.

16:41.66
alli koch
Looking around like what am I personally buying what am I styling my house as what am I comfortable in and it was really just neutrals black and white like I’m really drawn to textures things like that and so I would do all of those canvases for other clients that were. Pink and the glitter and like afterward I would just feel drained up like I just they loved it and it was exactly what they were wanting. But for me I was like oh this isn’t that great or like I stopped painting on canvases because I hated painting on canvases and so I slowly just. Over the time was like okay I’m not gonna paint on canvas anymore I’m only gonna do paper or I’m only gonna do wood panels and just slowly kind of adding that into my business and finally when I was making my own art. It was only black and white stuff and so I would make that stuff for me post it on social media. And people were drawn to it. So everything every aspect that I am doing and have been doing all stimmed from creating it for myself first.

17:46.28
charukaarora
Wow! Amazing now when a lot of your work is also commission based because you’re amural artist a lot of people commission you what is your I’m I’m going to have a lot of technical questions now because I know a lot of people struggle with these questions.

17:53.93
alli koch
Students.

18:02.80
alli koch
Yada in.

18:04.88
charukaarora
Like you know when you’re a commission-based artist. You have a very iconic style and you know how do you maintain like a portfolio that also gives you enough opportunity to take you know more projects and show like what Moy can do but also um, let you maintain a style That’s very you.

18:07.20
alli koch
Oh.

18:24.35
charukaarora
And I think you do that Very well.

18:25.17
alli koch
Yeah, you definitely don’t have to show every single thing. That’s the great about Instagram is that it is literally just a highlight real you just I only post what I want to highlight? there are so many merals that I’ve done that I it’s just like. Every color under the sun and I’m like well I really don’t want to be known for this. So I’m not going to post her I’m not going to post it as much I’ve definitely added way more color over the past year couple of months really just because I mean it’s always.

18:43.73
charukaarora
The statistics.

18:59.18
charukaarora
Yeah.

18:59.92
alli koch
To Evolve. It’s always again like don’t put yourself in a box like if you’re only gonna do black and white artwork and so it’s just like okay I’m gonna do black and white but maybe pops of color here and there and and I still feel like it’s pretty true to myself of like the elements that like for example, I just did a mural this past Weekend. And the flowers are black and white. But then everything around it was Color. So the flowers I Most known for are black and white. So that still stay true to me. But then adding that color for the client. Um, so it was a good like just blend of both parties.

19:32.50
charukaarora
Yeah, okay, um, when it comes to business I think that’s something that you have a lot to share about because you grew from you knew nothing and then from that you’ve built this business and you’ve become. You’ve also become widely popular on the internet. Let’s talk about um that side of your work. First yeah, go ahead? No no go ahead.

19:57.40
alli koch
Yeah I actually go ahead. Yeah no I ah kind of nerd out about the business side I personally really like doing it and yeah I think a lot of people realize that. When you have an art business. It’s not just painting every day like there are multiple multiple days where I do not paint a single thing like for example today I was on my computer all day long doing invoices emails follow-ups meetings.

20:19.42
charukaarora
Absolutely.

20:34.83
alli koch
Things like that. So it really is more than probably 50% of the the work is just the business side of there. Yes, there is designing of like proposals. But you have to design and then send proposals and emails and back and forth and our visions and.

20:48.85
charukaarora
Yeah.

20:53.40
alli koch
There’s sometimes it that feels like creative and a lot of times. It just feels like it says it is. It’s work. But again like I Really enjoy it I Love Excel sheets and making to do lists and sending and answering emails and things like that. But yeah I have so many artists that.

20:54.33
charukaarora
She doesn’t.

21:00.28
charukaarora
Oh my God really.

21:10.70
alli koch
Artist friends that are like oh I hate the business side like I want to be I want my business to grow by like okay well if you want your business to grow. You got to grow the business meaning like you got to grow the like the actual business side of things. Um, and you can if you don’t if you like absolutely hate it like there’s obviously.

21:18.15
charukaarora
Yeah.

21:28.29
alli koch
Other means of hiring an agent or a manager they’re going to take a cut of things but then you can only focus on the creative side. So that’s also an option but I truly do think that I’m able to grow my business faster doing it myself.

21:43.20
charukaarora
And now let’s talk about your lessons of growing that like you know, growing to a 6 figure business with something a lot of artists aspire to be I think a lot of artists get caught in the way, a lot of times like you know is this. Good enough if this not good enough Am I becoming too commercial am I being too. You know this this boundary I think that this holds a lot of art is back because a lot of artists are also scared about like not fitting like you know, well like oh this is not art. Oh This is you know.

22:15.87
alli koch
In in.

22:18.54
charukaarora
You’ve become a sellout who become like you know there is. There’s so much stigma around a lot of these things um, have do you had like what are your thoughts on that.

22:27.29
alli koch
Yeah I mean it’s it’s challenging because there are I do think there are 2 categories of art. There are like the artists that is in the galleries and they’re painting canvases and they do shows and their commissions. Are maybe for like hotels or interdeigners that are like more home. They probably don’t have like an online shop but then there’s also the artists that are kind of in my category where it is like art licensing product development commercial. It.

22:57.16
charukaarora
Snow.

23:05.53
alli koch
It is more run like a business like not necessarily like a target but like how there’s multiple different streams of income and revenue coming into that business whereas a traditional artist with commissions of artwork and they only work on an art piece.

23:07.50
charukaarora
See yeah.

23:25.90
alli koch
For a month and that’s their month of that I’m gonna just work on this one art piece but then sell it for X amount of dollars so you just have to really focus and determine from an an early stage of like what you want to do like that other like that.

23:27.90
charukaarora
Yeah.

23:42.93
alli koch
Showroom artist like that’s not me like I can’t just like sit down and create just out of the blue I Really thrive on the collaborations between the clients. The collaborations between me and like my potential customers that are.

23:48.97
charukaarora
So yeah.

24:00.74
alli koch
Going to buy my stuff on website and really the stuff on my website is just like Okay, what do I want or what do I need to give to someone so everything on my website is pretty much like I made it for myself and I put it on there I gifted it to a friend and they’re like someone saw it and like oh I want to.

24:06.12
charukaarora
Ah.

24:18.15
alli koch
Buy that. So then I put it on my on my website. So um, yeah I just had to I think I saw that it was easier to grow and easier to have a salary when I set up my art as a business I Sometimes even really like think of myself as a businessperson.

24:18.70
charukaarora
Go round.

24:31.53
charukaarora
Yeah, do.

24:37.59
alli koch
More So as a business person that knows how to design essentially. So yeah.

24:40.40
charukaarora
Yeah, oh Wow I Love and you put it that Way. You know when I was going to your website something that I Really loved you. Did this collaboration and you had this long beautiful wheel. Can you talk about that project because I was stunned. I Loved It. Do We like the right wheel that you had.

24:58.20
alli koch
A long beautiful which ones are you cut out? Oh yes, a wedding veil. Yeah, that was an amazing collaboration I have been very fortunate and just being authentic. On social media draws people in and they feel like they know you and they want to work with you. So that collaboration came to me like that I had no idea that that could even be possible so that came to me through my inbox and she’s like hey I love your beautiful artwork. Can we put this on veils I’m like yes. Also you are like 3 years too late because I wish I had this for my own mudding. Um, but yeah, that was a beautiful beautiful collaboration. Yeah, it’s very very different. Yeah, that was also one of those like.

25:45.58
charukaarora
And very different very different I don’t think I see a lot of artists do this.

25:53.75
alli koch
Projects that I was just like so excited about and I probably would have done for free and we just like I just want to have this I Definitely like undercut myself on that because I I didn’t want her to say no but just being able to have those veils.

25:56.50
charukaarora
Um, coverage. Yeah.

26:09.50
alli koch
For a lifetime is is definitely worth it and being able to be a part of other people’s weddings is is definitely worth it. I Definitely think that. Ah, there should be a good balance of projects that are just good for the soul I think that’s what helps kind of like that question that you had earlier like how.

26:10.34
charukaarora
Um I.

26:21.85
charukaarora
Yeah.

26:28.56
alli koch
You not feel like you’re kind of settling or conforming to society and whatnot of like being a business so I try to really have projects yearly that are like okay this is just food for my soul like I’m just gonna create this I would do this for for you. But I’m still gonna charge you for a little bit but. Was definitely one of those projects where I’m just like this is why I like being an artist because I’m able to create stuff like that.

26:52.32
charukaarora
I Love that because it’s I I think then I saw you but that I was so stuned because you know we all see um, artist collaboration so lines and everything but this was something really out of line and very different and still very you and I was like how I mean.

27:01.50
alli koch
Yeah. Um.

27:11.24
charukaarora
It’s such beautiful integration of also seeing how how our working be translated in several different mediums. Yeah yeah.

27:17.10
alli koch
Yes, in so many different ways so that you don’t even think of yeah and to go back on like a good thing to like really think about is like ah it’s not all about like the roi like the return on investment like how much money am I going to make I just had to talk with.

27:28.60
charukaarora
Yeah.

27:33.94
alli koch
At a conference and she’s like well I didn’t really I don’t think I’m gonna make this much money on this project I’m like yeah but look at the outcome of like the people that you’re going to meet and the other businesses that could be attracted to your work because of this project. So I definitely look out for those projects all the time. Um. If. It’s a low budget I Definitely see if I see potential and it’s like a low budget I’m still always going to take it or if there’s like no budget I’m still always going to take it because I know that there’s value in the marketing and the the outcomes that will come from from that project.

28:08.93
charukaarora
Like that. Yeah, you also have like a like yours ah own personal online shop. You’ll also talk about your books. But before that let’s just also talk about your online shop which is quite extensive. You have quite a good prana client.

28:22.30
alli koch
A.

28:26.28
charukaarora
Now a lot of people artists want and I feel like online shops a great way to you know, have control no matter if you’re a fine artist illustrate your commission. Whatever works that you’re doing. But if you have access to something that’s in your own hand. You can also I feel like it’s it’s a great avenue to play like you know you can always experiment and do all of those things but a lot of people struggle with growing an online shop today especially because the market has become even more saturated. Um, also a lot of times.

28:47.43
alli koch
Oh who.

28:55.76
alli koch
Inhoo.

29:02.11
charukaarora
Now we have drop shipping services. Basically for anyone who’s listening like you don’t have to like patch like ship manufacture. You just integrate them on your website and then they do everything for you now. Can you talk about your experience of setting up your shop growing it and how much does that.

29:02.39
alli koch
Um, yes, yes, yes.

29:21.48
charukaarora
Bring stability in your business in some in terms of financially and like let’s just talk about that because I I know you will have great advices.

29:28.56
alli koch
Yeah, that so I knew when I started my art business that having like seasonal artwork and just.

29:32.55
charukaarora
When.

29:42.18
alli koch
People that have an online shop or a storefront like that is hard work. It’s a lot of stress. It’s a lot of turnover and I knew that I didn’t want to do that. It’s just not who my personality is not a good match for that. But I was coming out with books and so I was like okay well I can’t just sell. Books on my website like I might as well have other things and so that’s how I started off with just doing little art prints and t-shirts and then like I said earlier it has grown so much because I’ll either make something for myself and then someone sees and they’re like oh my gosh I want to buy this. And like okay I’ll I’ll make it I started getting burned out because I would make it because 2 people would say that they would want to buy it so I’m like oh I have to buy I have to make this now and then those 2 people never showed up and I sold like 3 ah so I was okay well I’m never doing.

30:26.91
charukaarora
Um, times.

30:36.30
charukaarora
Um, oh my god.

30:39.55
alli koch
Yeah, I’m never doing this again. So the minute I discovered drop shipping. It was a game changer as I go Well this is perfect I don’t have any The only upfront cost is me ordering samples or me ordering stuff for myself and seeing if I like it and then just adding it to my website. It’s so easy if someone is listening and they want to open up a. Online Chop Please do drop shipping and time is time is money and so I was wasting so much time doing orders and I hated it as I hey I either need to hire someone which costs a lot of money or I just need to do another or I just need to not do an online shop or I need to figure out.

31:01.60
charukaarora
Yeah.

31:13.18
charukaarora
Ah, right, not get enough.

31:18.40
alli koch
Something else and I’m glad that I I found drop shipping. But yes.

31:20.13
charukaarora
Yeah, and I think a lot of times I think a lot of times people as you know we get discouraged because you expect some saying it doesn’t show up like let’s say the people that were.

31:26.45
alli koch
Yeah, definitely.

31:33.25
alli koch
Yes, yes, yes like hello. Yeah yeah I know but with dropshipping like you can literally sell one and it’s fine and no one would know. Um.

31:35.70
charukaarora
Encouraging and then they don’t show up and you’re relying on them and you’re like okay and it’s very heartbreaking I this is for you? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

31:50.97
alli koch
Know and it just like saves up so much time when you’re like your house and things like that. But my online shopp is definitely passive. So I think what has definitely helped grow my business into a 6 figure business and that’s not I’ve only been a sixoyear business for the past. 2 three years out of the seven years I had been in business so it definitely didn’t happen in the early stages. It just really happened in the later stages but it was when I started to really kind of hone in on my passive income streams. but’ 1 person that told me that most millioners have 7 sources of pass incomes and so as okay, that’s a perfect goal I’m nowhere near a million dollars like not even close but it was a good kind of like okay like goal and like okay how can I stretch out like k to be 7.

32:28.81
charukaarora
7 i.

32:46.56
alli koch
Passes of income and it was a really, it’s ah it’s been a really good challenge and so just trying to have different things like you. It’s just so hard to have a creative business and only have like 1 or 2 streams of income. It’s going to.

32:59.71
charukaarora
And yeah.

33:03.65
alli koch
Yeah, it’s just really stressful and like if there’s a pandemic that happens and then those 2 sources of income income are shot then like you’re kind of screwed and so I really saw what was great is like having those multiple passive incomes I kind of.

33:12.35
charukaarora
Yeah.

33:21.80
alli koch
Say that it’s like business insurance. Essentially so like when 2 kind of fall off the face of the earth then the other ones I can really lean into and really have those backups.

33:32.39
charukaarora
Lovely and I’m sure that has that would have served you um in in the pandemic because the murals of course. Um.

33:40.13
alli koch
Yeah, the murals. Yeah, the murals stopped completely and so I was like oh my gosh and murals are the biggest kind of pie or slice of ah out of my pie and so it was like oh my gosh. What’s going to happen but I actually made them more money that I have been have I’ve actually made more money than I’ve had in the past.

33:46.92
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

33:59.95
alli koch
During the pandemic which was crazy but I really just honed in on those other passive incomes and so now I’ve really seen a huge growth of being able to lean into those other sources of income grow those but then murals came back and so my business is just kind of. Been better than it has ever been.

34:17.52
charukaarora
Oh um, now let’s also talk about something that you’re also highly popular and known for which are your books Can you talk about how that happened how has your journey um, been making these books.

34:23.87
alli koch
Yes.

34:32.80
alli koch
That is also another kind of a very feel very blessed and thankful um to have the opportunity I was approached by my publisher that I still work with today and they’re like hey we want you to write a. How to draw floralbook like it wasn’t even my idea like they’re like we saw we see this lap. This was I think it was like 2 years into my business 2 or 3 so I was still fairly fresh.

34:54.53
charukaarora
Um, when was this.

35:03.19
charukaarora
Wow.

35:09.37
alli koch
And so they saw a lack in the kind of book world of like there’s not really modern how to draw floral books and so at first I thought it was a scam I was like well how much money I’m have to pay then like this doesn’t seem right and my dad actually has published books in the past and so I.

35:18.75
charukaarora
Um.

35:25.25
charukaarora
Oh well.

35:27.32
alli koch
I brought him the contract and he’s like no this is legit contract like you need to do this I’m like but I don’t draw I don’t draw a lot of flowers like I would draw flowers here and there on like wedding invitations. Um, and I was like oh I don’t know why they’re asking me like this just doesn’t seem because at the time I would.

35:36.88
charukaarora
Oh wows.

35:45.37
alli koch
Looking up to other instagrammers that were drawing beautiful florals and I was like why didn’t they ask them like this just seems really fishy and my dad was like they asked you for a reason they obviously saw something in me and I asked my publisher was like why did you ask me then like well you just have this like heart of giving and that.

35:54.15
charukaarora
You.

36:05.21
alli koch
We saw that so much throughout your Instagram which I didn’t think that I was like was I wasn’t saying that in my Instagram captions or anything like that. But they just saw it through what I was posting when what what I was sharing and like we just think that you would be a great author.

36:11.28
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

36:22.92
alli koch
So I’m so glad that they took a chance on me and then they saw something in me that I didn’t see in myself and so I wrote my first book thought that was going to be my last book and they’re like okay this book did really great. Let’s do another one I was like okay so I did my second book florals by hand and if you.

36:24.50
charukaarora
The wow.

36:33.62
charukaarora
Oh ah.

36:40.67
alli koch
Have ever seen any of my books you’ll notice that like florals by hand is double the size of my first book because I really thought that that was gonna be my last book as okay, this is my last one my last raw like let’s put it all out in this book and that did really well and actually hobby lobby which is a craft store here in the Us.

36:56.98
charukaarora
Yeah.

37:00.20
alli koch
They approach my publisher and they like hey we want to do coloring books and we want them to come from Allie and 1 other artist that was in the publishing house and they’re like okay so I was like all right I guess we’re gonna do coloring books we thought coloring books were.

37:15.70
charukaarora
Yeah.

37:15.31
alli koch
Not in anymore. But obviously they are I was like okay well I want to do a coloring book I want to make it something unique and something that’s for me because I’m not a big colorer I think that they’re actually stressful I hate all of those like teeny tiny dots I was like this is not This is not cause I mean.

37:26.50
charukaarora
Um, ah oh my god.

37:33.49
alli koch
Instant gratification person like if I’m going to do something I want to do it in all 1 setting I was like there’s no way I can get this in an all one setting. So I made sure that the coloring book that I made was something that was easy and approachable and and fun. So I did that Dan thin there didn’t. Then during the pandemic I did kids books I really saw a need for all of these parents that were now having to homeschool all their kids and okay, let’s do some kids’ books. So I came out with 3 kids books during the pandemic kind of back toback which was a little crazy. Yeah.

37:59.91
charukaarora
Um, no wow 3

38:06.84
alli koch
Um, and then another in coloring book just because my first one did well and now I’m coming out with another coloring book. Um, and there is and I just signed a deal to do 2 more books this week so yeah I don’t think I will so I’ve now.

38:11.73
charukaarora
Oh good. So There’s like books all over the place. Oh wow.

38:26.70
alli koch
Stop saying this is my last book because I I don’t think yes I don’t think Ili will stop writing books anytime soon. So I’m very very pleased to be able to and I have actually had a conversation with a publisher this afternoon and he’s like.

38:29.27
charukaarora
I’m sure there should I There shouldn’t be any last.

38:35.39
charukaarora
Oh land guide.

38:44.95
alli koch
Like we could ask any publisher to do these kids books or do another coloring book but like we ask you because you’re so easy to work with and um things like that. So. It’s super just having a good spirit about things same positive. Being easy to work with like those are really great characteristics that you need to have in order to have definitely a lot of possibilities. So.

39:08.60
charukaarora
Yeah, that’s true out of everything that you do I I also have 1 more question then I’ll ask this actually you have well the most unique podcast I have to say that can you.

39:21.96
alli koch
That life.

39:26.67
charukaarora
Can you talk about that and what I mean I was when I figured and I I got to um, like know about your podcast which is breakfast with says who’s your says in that would you like to share. Okay.

39:36.94
alli koch
Yes, so I’m Cis I do a podcast with my dad. Ah every we we’ve taken a break. Um.

39:45.95
charukaarora
Yes.

39:51.66
alli koch
During the pandemic. It was really hard for us to do a podcast. It was just every week. It was the same old same o and so we took a break. Um and hopefully our lives have been so busy so we’re trying to get back into getting into the groove of doing it. But. We still do breakfast every Saturday morning and so I’ve been having a breakfast date with my dad since I was 13 and now I’m about to turn 30 one so it’s been a long time. A long tradition and so one day we’re just like these conversations.

40:17.40
charukaarora
Wow.

40:26.51
alli koch
Really great. We should probably start our podcast and that’s exactly what we did so we have just been recording our Saturday morning conversations and it’s truly raw and we never know what we’re gonna talk about. We sometimes have guests join us for breakfast but we typically do it. At a chick -fil-a that’s another reason why we had to take a break because chick-filas were close. Um, it’s a fast food chain here in the us. But yeah, we just have genuine conversations about life and ups and downs and our highs and lows and.

40:47.57
charukaarora
2

41:02.29
alli koch
What’s going on in my business and what’s going on in his business and and things like that. So so he actually is just got a new job but he used to work at.

41:05.81
charukaarora
What does your father do.

41:18.00
alli koch
A tax firm for Hr like so but he calls him Chief people officer because he is the he likes to be um, likes to develop people so that’s essentially like every job that he’s had. It’s all based around like helping and developing people.

41:26.86
charukaarora
No out.

41:34.34
charukaarora
Ah, so you I do feel like your dad has a lot of influence in you and his skin because it’s oh wow, That’s a nice to yeah because Breakfast withes and I was like when I was going to I was like this is so cool make because.

41:38.51
alli koch
Oh definitely definitely Yes, My best mentor.

41:54.14
charukaarora
Very different than um I What that’s what I think I could really.

41:55.74
alli koch
I know you? yeah he calls me sits. That’s where it comes from now. Yeah I have since my brother was born. He’s always called me Cis so it’s like short for sister.

42:08.91
charukaarora
Wow And that’s what I really liked about your work is that I Whenever you do something you can see that you do you do it it from a place of very playfulness and I think that is something that we when we go into business and then we are doing all of these things and everything goes like. Successes investments business. All of those things come In. We often forget to play you know that’s that’s the whole point of why we started There’s why we chose this part. How do you? so keep yourselves. How do you keep growing your business. But.

42:28.49
alli koch
Oh yes, Yes, yes.

42:45.48
charukaarora
Also not take yourself too seriously in this process.

42:46.28
alli koch
Oh man, you you can’t um I Definitely think my husband plays a good part into That. He’s a big kid and an adult body so he’s constantly just making me laugh and just making me. Remind myself that not to take myself too seriously or that life just can’t be taken too. Seriously I’m very stressful person. So I think trying to be oh yes, oh yes, Um, yeah Therapy helps with that. But also laughter helps quite a bit. So.

43:09.95
charukaarora
Really.

43:20.27
charukaarora
Find a husband who makes you laugh.

43:21.74
alli koch
I Mean there’s just something where you just kind of yes, find out what makes you laugh or laugh for yourself things like that. So a friend that makes you laugh? Um, but yeah, like I was always get always ah caught up in going to live life after my to do list was done and I like looked up I’m like okay my to do list is. Never going to be done So It’s just a never ending wheel so that was a big wake up call of okay you need to stop like having your own Business. You have the ability and the pleasure of making your own. Schedule and being your own boss and so I’m sometimes a too hard of a boss on myself but trying to remind myself that I do have the privilege of being able to do what I can and when I can and how long and how much and it’s something that I.

44:17.27
charukaarora
Yeah, thanks yeah.

44:19.92
alli koch
Forget about all the time but trying to live life outside of work is definitely always the key kind of goal in front of my mind.

44:24.67
charukaarora
I Love that I think that I think when you go into business and when I think this is something we learn before like this is the hard that you get before you get down because.

44:36.76
alli koch
Yes.

44:39.46
charukaarora
Like we sometimes I think you all anyone who gets into business. We all experience that tip that you lose yourself in your work and then there’s this one day when you wake up and you realize like even to grow this. You need to first get it out. Get out of it.

44:50.61
alli koch
Yes, yes, just do it Dress do it Yes on.

44:55.19
charukaarora
Okay, my last question and then we’ll jump into the rapid fire. Okay, which is you have grown your business. You are definitely great with what you do not only your creative side. But for your business side. Um. What is that 1 thing that you think especially anyone who’s listening because um, a lot of artists have same desires as I’m sure that you’re making possible true and I think what I really absolutely admire. You know when you do something like when I see you do do things you know. It inspires me and it it makes it believe me that if she can do it then it’s also possible for me. Ah, but again with social media now getting on a nerves a lot of times and you’ve been widely popular on Instagram that’s also just touch upon your journey of Instagram and how has that. Helped you and how you approach it so that anyone who wants to have or has similar goals can do that just in general my question is what has helped you the most and what can people who are hearing right now pick up so that they can move the needle for themselves and go um. Chase the dream that they have.

46:13.90
alli koch
Yeah, definitely um, not to be like ah a dubbie downer of this question. But I think definitely like knowing that Instagram is only a highlight real and you only see certain aspects of 1 person’s life and.

46:24.77
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

46:32.54
alli koch
Realizing like everyone’s journey is going to be different so like for me like I I don’t have kids. Um, it’s just me my husband I’ve been with my husband since I was 14 so we’re definitely not in like a home.

46:34.37
charukaarora
Death left.

46:46.63
charukaarora
Um, wow.

46:50.10
alli koch
I Know so we’ve been together for a long time. So We’re super comfortable just chilling if I’m working in bed and he’s working in bed like we’re okay and we can still connect and things like that. Um, but yeah, so I don’t have kids I’ve been with their has been for a while um I live in a very large. City that is great for community and really supports the arts. There’s like all these different aspects that are behind the scenes that someone might not realize that helps and benefits me growing my business so you have to. Go into knowing like the time that you put in is what you’re also going to get out So I put a lot of time into this business and so I’m able to get a lot of this the benefits of growing it and yeah so I put a lot of time into it which makes. It seemed like I get a lot out of it if that makes sense. Um, so that’s definitely like yes like dream big but also make sure that you have you set up your what’s the word dream big but also no like.

47:46.34
charukaarora
Um, know and absolutely that.

47:54.40
charukaarora
I can.

48:05.43
alli koch
Not your limitations but just like know that there’s so many other things that go into dreaming and going into making plans in your business and and making sure that you also set those up and also knowing okay like I want to be like all like k but I live in a small town that doesn’t have a lot of of walls available like maybe move. A bigger town things like that. So. But yeah Instagram is a really really great tool. It’s a love hair relationship for sure you feel like you kind of have to like constantly like feed the beast but I’ve actually made like some of my.

48:25.45
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

48:35.76
charukaarora
Yes.

48:40.91
alli koch
Best best friends off of Instagram so like the magic definitely happens once you get off of Instagram a lot of my business does come from Instagram because they have seen my Instagram but they’ve also has come from word of mouth of like yes they might have known me from Instagram but like for example.

48:41.36
charukaarora
I agree.

49:00.80
alli koch
Got to deal with fossil because they were in a meeting fossil was meeting and they’re like hey we should do a mural and so one girl was like oh my gosh I know this girl on Instagram they showed her. They showed my portfolio and.

49:03.83
charukaarora
3

49:14.50
charukaarora
A profile.

49:17.74
alli koch
They were like oh she’s great. Let’s book her so definitely the magic happen. Yeah, so definitely like you definitely want to be top of mind um of when someone is like oh I need something you want to be the first person that they think of so in order to do that. You have to really connect with those people.

49:19.29
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

49:30.18
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

49:35.74
alli koch
On a personal level.

49:35.77
charukaarora
Yes, lovely I love that Allie this was wonderful. You share such great insights I am so grateful. Thank you so much. Let’s get into the rapid fire. It’s small and rapid fire.

49:45.15
alli koch
Of course any time I I love that I can’t wait I don’t even know what these questions are so I’m so curious.

49:56.15
charukaarora
Ah, okay, so are you ready? you get just give me what comes to your mind. There’s no right and wrong quick one okay 1 2 3 here we go 1 thing you want to convey through your work in the arts.

50:01.16
alli koch
Yes, yes, perfect.

50:10.52
alli koch
Um, confidence.

50:13.18
charukaarora
What describes 1 word that describes you the past.

50:18.80
alli koch
Um, down to earth I know that’s kind of like 3 words but we’ll heighten it.

50:28.46
charukaarora
It’s a it’s a we take that if you got if you could have a studio anywhere in the world where would it be who really, you’re a city girl.

50:34.40
alli koch
Oh New York for sure. Yeah I I yes I am I live in Dallas so a lot of people might think like it’s like oh cowboy boots and country live in but I definitely love I’m definitely a city girl I go to New York every year and don’t think I could actually like live there but I definitely go to New York every year to visit. There’s just something about the air and the environment and the people and the architecture just gives me a good creative burst of excitement definitely actually like.

50:54.67
charukaarora
Yeah.

51:04.60
charukaarora
Wow, Your biggest source of inspiration.

51:13.64
alli koch
My friends in the entrepreneur world seeing them be successful and seeing them go through their challenges because it’s hard. It’s you’re by yourself a lot of times and so you think that you’re going through the same that you’re going through the struggles alone. But really, you’re not.

51:22.60
charukaarora
Yeah.

51:29.94
charukaarora
Yeah.

51:31.68
alli koch
All these other creative artists are going through the same struggles so they’re just inspiring like if if they are doing really great. It pushes me to do really great. So.

51:38.61
charukaarora
I Love this answer I Love this answer. Okay, you who’s your favorite woman artist any point of time.

51:46.33
alli koch
Ah, man this is hard. So Ah I Personally don’t look at a lot of other art. Um I think it has helped me stay true to myself. Um, and say true to who I am obviously I love going to like the met and and the museum and looking at at all of that. But I try to not really scroll through pinterest a lot um or look at like yes I Follow a lot of other creative artists. But I Love um I Love like.

52:14.99
charukaarora
Yeah.

52:23.91
charukaarora
Um, hello.

52:25.19
alli koch
Following pottery artists and florist like I follow a ton of floists that gorll their own florals. So I don’t know if I I think probably so my my good friend Sarah the mint gardner. She’s a watercolor artist and she is a true.

52:42.77
charukaarora
Annie.

52:44.33
alli koch
True Dear friend to me but I absolutely just get just captivated by her artwork and when she paints and her voice is so soothing So I would probably have to say her all my other art friends are probably like what about me. But.

52:48.83
charukaarora
Um, and her.

52:55.45
charukaarora
Um, love that who can you can you re me like ah say her name again.

53:03.25
alli koch
Yes, so Sarah from the mint gardener. Yes, she’s amazing. Yes, she’s the kindest soul. Yes.

53:08.54
charukaarora
Oh I follow her I Love her world. Yes, yes oh wow, not that Okay, who’s you go to person where you be you are in trouble or in need of advice.

53:25.99
alli koch
Definitely my dad He is my number one go to. He’s my my biggest cheerleader I look up to him so much I tell myself all the time from a very early age I’ve always said like I want to be just like my dad and so I think I am accomplishing that goal which is.

53:27.50
charukaarora
Yeah, and.

53:36.92
charukaarora
Oh wow oh wow, that’s so nice. Okay, this is a little more than a one but can you share like 1 moment anything any moment out of so many I’m sure you must have had.

53:43.30
alli koch
Which is fun.

53:54.69
charukaarora
But you felt really, you had the strategy and you felt very grateful to do to be doing what you’re doing today just one. Yeah, just you know, being grateful for an artist anything that just any 1 moment.

53:58.87
alli koch
Really grateful. Um, yeah, so when I was traveling to Europe I went to Rome and I’m visiting the colosseum and. And my husband are taking photos and then this girl is like out of the blue. She’s like oh my gosh are you aie k and I’m like yes I am she’s like I follow you, you are so inspiring I love that and that was like a goosebump moment for me.

54:32.49
charukaarora
Oh.

54:35.29
alli koch
Really realizing that like it’s not just me behind the phone or behind my computer in Dallas like my art and my books is a global reach like that is just like I have goosebumps really just talking about it right now that.

54:40.56
charukaarora
Yeah.

54:47.81
charukaarora
Yeah.

54:54.16
alli koch
There are people all over the world that know who I am and that look up to me and that I’m helping build their confidence I have so many opportunities of things that I can help people with my books and I get so many messages of people saying like oh my gosh Your books have helped me and now I have my own business. So It’s just. Really great to be able to be bigger than myself.

55:14.51
charukaarora
I Love that. That’s so my okay shout out to an artist. You’re currently loving on social media.

55:24.27
alli koch
Um, ah, okay, so since I shouted on my good friend Sarah from the maingarer I’m going to shout out my other good friend. Um Colleen um, she’s calling Elizabeth I’m pretty sure her art. Her Instagram is either calling Elizabeth or calling Elizabeth are it.

55:34.65
charukaarora
Okay.

55:44.19
alli koch
I probably shouldn’t know this I I never look at her Instagram name because I just know that it’s her but she is a phenomenal artist. Ah she does beautiful paint by numbers and I don’t know how she does it she? Yeah, she’s really great. So I always love following her.

55:58.93
charukaarora
Amazing and you can you dm me heard profile so I will link all artists that you I know Mindy of the main cot but I will also figure this one out and I’m can wait to check out and anyone who’s listening guys. Please you can find all the artists.

56:04.17
alli koch
Yeah now. Yes.

56:18.52
charukaarora
Ali has mentioned in this podcast on the show notes. So you go check out. Um, both of them and get them like calling perfect. Okay, my last sa 5 question.

56:24.47
alli koch
Yeah, it’s calling Elizabeth underscore art. Yeah.

56:34.60
charukaarora
As a woman on top Now What’s that one advice that you would like to give to people who are coming behind you who are just starting out or whatever I mean one advice.

56:42.28
alli koch
Yeah, So my best advice that I was given and so I this is the best advice that I can always give is my dad’s all that I’m very a perfectionist over just. Over Analyze everything overgues everything and so my dad one day came to Me. He’s like you know what? like if it was perfect. It wouldn’t look handmade and the minute he said that sentence it was a game changer in my head I was like oh my gosh you’re right.

57:16.88
charukaarora
Yeah, yeah.

57:17.33
alli koch
Like people are hiring me because they are wanting a handmade piece they wanted something perfect. They could have done it on the computer or ordered a sticker or something like that. So I embrace all those imperfections because it shows that this was an. 1 of a kind handmade piece.

57:34.97
charukaarora
Lovely I love that prize. Oh my god Allie this was amazing. Thank you so much you was quite a pro at this my my last thing and my last question before I let you go is.

57:44.28
alli koch
Thank you.

57:52.69
charukaarora
Anyone who’s listening to this episode first where can the finding support you um, can you tell where they can you know on Instagram your website anywhere else that you do and also if there’s anything else that coming up any new project anything when we where we can support. You please let us know and we you know. Love to know more about what’s cooking up from your end.

58:13.63
alli koch
Yeah, a ton of things cooking up I have another book coming out with supply chain shoes I have no idea when it’s coming out. Um, so sometime this year. Ah, but it’s super easy to find it’s Allie K A L L I k design that’s on http://alikadesign.com

58:17.35
charukaarora
Medium.

58:33.52
alli koch
Um, alikaign instagram alleign Tiktok ah, my email is hello@allocatkadesign. So it’s super easy to find me? Um, but yeah, just I love it when people interact with me on social media. It helps. Kind of keep that that app not so blah or not so just like a ah tool or I don’t know that’s the only thing that I keep going back to that social media and and not be such a dubbie downers because i.

58:55.90
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

59:09.85
alli koch
And reminded that I can interact with people all over the world. So That’s for any person like if you really love an account like just always interact with them like them comment things like that it really does make a difference and it really kind of boosts our self-esteem and kind of keeps us going On. Creating all this content for free for other people.

59:28.76
charukaarora
Yeah, lovely. Thank you so much Ali this was so much fun. Thank you so much I really had a great time and I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much. Thank you I’ll see you soon.

59:38.88
alli koch
Um, of course. Thank you bye.

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