00:00.16
charukaarora
Hi Sala Hi Tain Welcome to the podcast. Oh my I am so excited I Really am truly truly excited and I’m not saying this just because like you’re a guest and I don’t like I am excited for all episodes. But this is a very different feeling because.

00:03.34
Sara McCorriston
Hi Thanks for having us.

00:04.98
Jason Chen
Hi Thanks for having us.

00:19.62
charukaarora
You know this is like a constant in my life because a lot of our community and my friends that I really you know share my creative life with and a lot of who I am are based in the Us especially where you guys are so a lot of my friends have actually shown with you worked with you I remember when you were like doing this fundraiser for.

00:37.94
Sara McCorriston
Again.

00:38.53
charukaarora
The gallery I remember like it felt so personal. It was like something like we did from arts to hearts. We shared it on our email list. We should share on our Instagram it really feels like I’ve known you guys even though I know this is the first time we are speaking in person but it truly feels differently.

00:44.51
Sara McCorriston
Oh thank you so much is.

00:54.81
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, oh my gosh. Thank you that That’s such a warm welcome. Thank you so much. We’re so grateful for you know the support that you’ve shown us even though we we all haven’t met before in person or even this way.

01:10.30
charukaarora
Yes, no thank you so much for the work you do and I think yes, yes, it’s now that’s true. We made it. We made it perfect. Thank you so much. Okay, so this is a very special episode because I have like it’s like it feels home. But before we get into it.

01:14.56
Jason Chen
It’s never too late.

01:17.65
Sara McCorriston
Ah, yeah.

01:28.90
Sara McCorriston
Um.

01:29.60
charukaarora
Why don’t you guys introduce yourself and where you from what you do for people who are listening but I’m sure a lot of you A lot of people already would know you on the podcast today.

01:40.87
Sara McCorriston
I’m Sarah Mccoriston I co-founded paradigm gallery with Jason Chen um so I am I’m from just outside of Philadelphia. So. Growing up New York and Philadelphia were my 2 cities so Philly has been home to me for um, a long time and um, yeah, and ah was there anything I missed and.

02:11.79
Jason Chen
No I think that’s sounds about right? Hi guys I my name is Jason Chen and I am a co-founder of paradigm gallery with Sarah Mccorriston

02:25.68
charukaarora
Oh hi. Oh we had some glitz from the platform I guess. Okay yes I can hear you No no, no, not at all I lost you just after I had my question.

02:29.68
Jason Chen
Oh. Oh okay, were you not able to hear us. Okay.

02:34.10
Sara McCorriston
Can you hear us.

02:44.00
Sara McCorriston
Okay, so I can chi redo my introduction. Okay so I am Sarah Mccoriston I co-founded paradigm gallery with Jason Chen um twelve and a half years ago

02:46.14
charukaarora
Ah, yes, please.

02:57.63
Sara McCorriston
And we’re still working together and running the gallery today and um, as far as where am I from I’m actually from just outside of Philadelphia. So um, New York and Philadelphia kind of in between and and so New York and Philadelphia were both. Cities I spent a lot of time in growing up and so Philadelphia has been home for a long time for me.

03:19.59
charukaarora
Wow, that’s amazing. What about you? Jason.

03:26.60
Jason Chen
Ah, yes I’m Jason Chen as Sarah mentioned we start a paradigm twelve years ago and we’re still working together and she hasn’t killed me yet. so yay um so ah I’m originally yes yes.

03:39.24
charukaarora
Um, twelve wind a half yard

03:41.31
Sara McCorriston
Ah.

03:43.56
Jason Chen
I’m originally from China um, so I’m an immigrant. Ah so I I moved here when I was 13 with my family. Um Philadelphia is the first city that I’ve been in in America and I feel like I haven’t left since I mean I lived in New Jersey for a while but you know who who’s counting those years

03:57.25
charukaarora
And.

03:59.79
Sara McCorriston
Um.

04:03.32
charukaarora
Tid. But but.

04:03.57
Jason Chen
Phillies what’s matters to me. Um, so yeah, that’s ah, that’s pretty much my background and you know Sarah and I met it at ah um university of the arts.

04:11.55
charukaarora
Oh yes I already only want to know how because I know Jason you’re a photographer and you you’re an artist yourself and Sarah let’s let’s let’s touch a little bit about who what you guys were doing before you started paradigm and how did you meet.

04:20.70
Jason Chen
It.

04:25.12
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, so so Jason and I were both students at the university of the arts and we met in maybe 2007 is my guess.

04:42.36
Jason Chen
Sounds about it. Yeah.

04:43.40
Sara McCorriston
Um, sounds about right? Yeah, and um I was I was in theater design. So everything you know set design costume design, lighting makeup. Um, just all all of that and and Jason.

04:45.58
charukaarora
It’s been that long.

04:51.36
charukaarora
Are.

04:59.44
Sara McCorriston
Was um, an animation major with a photo minor at the university of the arts and it kind of made it made sense with our different talents and passions to collaborate because I loved styling and Jason loved fashion photography. So.

05:19.12
Sara McCorriston
So we started working together. Ah we also both worked with a lot of dancers I did a lot of design for dance and dancers are are very great subjects and photographs especially with ah Jason wasn’t doing his photo weavings yet at the time. One of them is behind him. But. Um, dancers also movement of dancers and you know I almost feel like those early days of us collaborating together and working with dancers. Um still ties into his work today. but um but yeah that’s how we that’s how we started. You know we.

05:38.60
charukaarora
Um, oh wow. Yes.

05:54.40
Sara McCorriston
I lived with photography majors at the University of the arts we met through my my roommates I’m pretty sure and um and and we’ve been working together ever since but you know so we started working together in one way and in it and it um turned into something much bigger.

06:15.14
Jason Chen
Yeah, so as Sarah was saying um my my background is actually in film and animation. So I still do a lot of or hopefully still doing a lot of those. Um, oh okay, ah can you hear us right now.

06:35.52
Jason Chen
Ah, yeah, we we hear each other can you hear us Bummer hey.

06:39.49
Sara McCorriston
Listen.

06:43.80
charukaarora
Oh I I’m just going to do 1 thing but I’d lost you again I will try and switch I’ll just see if it’s my internet but which works perfectly.

06:47.68
Sara McCorriston
Okay.

06:53.81
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, we keep hearing we can hear each other Jason and I can hear each other just fine.

06:59.71
Jason Chen
Think she left can.

07:03.20
charukaarora
Yeah I lost you again I’m just going to switch mine to that first I Hope that’s all said.

07:07.88
Sara McCorriston
Okay. Where would you like us to pick back up.

07:21.39
Jason Chen
Yeah I think she’s reconnecting.

07:23.25
Sara McCorriston
Okay.

07:56.36
charukaarora
Hello.

08:10.21
Jason Chen
So.

08:11.49
Sara McCorriston
He.

08:26.94
charukaarora
Can you hear me now. Oh sorry I don’t know what’s happening today and I don’t think it’s either the internet or us I think it’s the platform that’s doing it today.

08:29.83
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, yeah.

08:30.27
Jason Chen
She left left. I Don’t see her in in the the thing anymore.

08:38.68
Sara McCorriston
Okay, oh you do I can see her.

08:45.56
Jason Chen
I Don’t see her.

08:45.94
charukaarora
Um, can you not see me.

08:50.15
Sara McCorriston
I can I think Jason isn’t able to yet really I do.

08:51.57
Jason Chen
Up there. She is okay I see her now. Oh or I’m a lot of delay I’m delaying like by a lot.

08:59.78
Sara McCorriston
Ah, okay.

09:01.61
charukaarora
You can hear me see me. Yeah actually are also showing me like a warning from Jason’s end ah as a health check here. It says.

09:13.27
Jason Chen
And you see maybe I would do this again.

09:14.80
Sara McCorriston
Okay.

09:17.98
charukaarora
It says the recommended minimum memory is a G B is the last space in your system.

09:35.95
Sara McCorriston
I Think there there must be such. There must be a delay for him I can I’m not sure.

09:41.57
charukaarora
You can’t can you can still can’t hear me. Um I think the problem is Jason has ah a little delay from his end and it’s also I think because of his stories because it’s showing. Ah, warning from his end I’m sorry I don’t know what’s happened today.

09:59.96
Sara McCorriston
Um, ok, looks like you? Yeah yeah, this is strange and everything is is fine on my end I’m like hearing and seeing everyone just fine.

10:09.66
charukaarora
The release.

10:13.30
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, yeah, they’re like I and that every time you you know every time you’ve said like can you hear me or I’ve lost you I’ve been able to see you like I haven’t had a problem so it’s really strange.

10:20.88
charukaarora
Agree this is acting I think in castes also act think a little weird are today because my internet is perfect I just speak I just checked everything and it it works great I don’t know what is a little different today I think Jason is going to switch his setup. Because he just mentioned that in the beginning of his conusation.

10:46.23
Sara McCorriston
Okay, let’s see.

10:48.79
charukaarora
Or we mad now he’s back. You’re back? Yes, we can hear you oh my god I don’t know what’s happening today I’m going to keep my fingers cross I’ve switched my wifi so that shouldn’t be a problem any longer.

10:56.27
Jason Chen
Yes, great.

11:00.94
Sara McCorriston
Yeah.

11:07.96
charukaarora
Oh okay, sorry yes I remember you were saying that you had your roommates. Let’s go from there.

11:08.31
Sara McCorriston
Where should where should we pick up.

11:21.41
Sara McCorriston
So um, so Jason and I well but I can like do ah a recap um Jason and I met in around 2007 when we were both at university of the arts.

11:25.91
charukaarora
Yes, yes.

11:37.83
Sara McCorriston
Um I was in we were in different schools within or different colleges within the university of the arts Jason was in the um Jason was in the college was at college just college of art college of fine art college of fine art.

11:52.76
Jason Chen
I Think College a fine art. Yeah yeah.

11:54.98
Sara McCorriston
And then I was in the performing arts college um I was a theater design major so um, set design costume lighting sound makeup all of that and Jason was an animation major with a photography minor. And because I was really into styling and fashion through everything I was doing for theater and dance. Um, and ah and Jason was very much into fashion photography that the collaboration between the 2 of us when when my photography. Student roommates had it and introduced us um us collaborating it just made a lot of sense and um and so we started working together on a lot of Jason’s photo shoots and with a lot of the dancers that I regularly worked with and um. and I and I hope I’m not repeating myself. Um, by yeah, um, but it it really still comes through in Jason’s artwork to this day I think that the appreciation for the movement from the from dancers from the very beginning of us working together.

12:56.56
charukaarora
Um, no.

13:12.67
Sara McCorriston
And um, and yeah, it’s it. We’ve continued collaborating together ever since and and on on bigger and bigger things.

13:17.41
charukaarora
For yeah twelve and a half years that’s a really really long time like really a good great time tell me something why a gallery how has that like why did you guys I mean you Jason were an artist.

13:22.90
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah.

13:25.41
Jason Chen
Yeah.

13:36.60
charukaarora
Um, why did you choose a path of building a galley space and even for you Sara I think like it wasn’t like it wasn’t an obvious choice as like how did that come into being.

13:55.37
Jason Chen
Well, that kind of started. Um, when we graduated after we graduated we we were both looking for a studio space to actually do our own work and for for our own practice and then um.

14:12.40
Jason Chen
I had an idea I was talking to Sarah over dinner one one time and we were so I was saying that maybe when we’re not using the studio the space we could use it as like a gallery space to showcase our work and like our friends work and Sarah kind of took that to heart and um. Start looking at spaces because we’re we’re already been looking at spaces for pseudospace anyway. So um, and the next thing we know Sarah is like I found a space and we ah we had our first show and was like okay this makes more sense as a gallery.

14:41.15
charukaarora
Um.

14:51.70
Jason Chen
Um, and that kind of ah happened and twelve years later we’re we’re here.

14:53.93
charukaarora
So did you like go I’m I’m just asking like did you like actually made the entire space into the gallery space or did you actually keep a studio space or not.

14:54.14
Sara McCorriston
And we just kept growing along with it. The oh yeah.

15:09.24
charukaarora
Oh wow.

15:09.33
Sara McCorriston
The whole space became a gallery really I mean I still worked in the basement and I did a lot of sewing in the basement. Um the basement really wasn’t the best place for Jason to use as a photo studio though it had I had really low ceilings. It did not have any. Cleared out areas. Um that were all that useful for what he needed it to be so it and it was a really small space and um and it was you know and it was that’s good. But.

15:37.36
Jason Chen
I did use upstairs for like 1 or twice for like you know, different things and and let’s be honest, it’s like I don’t actually do photo shoots like a whole lot. So it’s not that I don’t you I don’t get to use it because it’s too small. It’s just I just it just wasn’t the time when I needed it and.

15:39.50
charukaarora
Um.

15:52.74
Sara McCorriston
His.

15:54.23
charukaarora
Um, now.

15:57.29
Jason Chen
I Think at a time I was also doing a lot of like available available lights and stuff like that. So I was doing on location a lot um shooting outside a lot and and it wasn’t really like needed a studio space. But um, but we you know I still use the the space for.

16:13.77
charukaarora
Wow.

16:14.40
Sara McCorriston
And I had had a studio prior and I most I needed studio space for doing things like like sewing costumes and and garments and so I was definitely working in the basement a lot.

16:15.92
Jason Chen
Ah, shoots here and there.

16:24.96
charukaarora
You know what now when I know your contacts and I like like even in the beginning of a conversation I said like I’m a I’m a person of wise and I I always try to connect the dots and now that I know your like individual stories I can really put together like the shows that you curate. It really makes so much sense and I think that’s also why I gravitate a lot towards your your curation and the way you work because I truly believe I really believe that what we as artists create like you know I think the community that you’ve been creating so far twelve and a half years

16:45.28
Sara McCorriston
Ah.

17:01.87
charukaarora
Um, I’m sitting in one part of India and I truly admire what you do and I think it’s it’s the energy that flows and I really I really think it comes as artists you um experience and you create for yourself and for people of your own community I think really makes a difference and then also like you know the show. You’ve been curating like Sara’s work like I can see like a pattern of why a lot of things come out the way they do because of who you as 2 individuals are.

17:30.69
Sara McCorriston
Absolutely I mean we show through in our curation so much.

17:34.72
charukaarora
See.

17:35.90
Jason Chen
Yeah, yeah I would say that um through our earlier cool wish curation it speaks more to our background. But as the gallery grows it. It definitely turned into something.

17:47.77
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

17:51.88
Jason Chen
A little bit more different. It’s definitely a little bit more fine art and and ah um, and and commercial focus in a way you know? um, but at the same time like we still you can still see some of the the tether of like how we curate.

17:52.32
Sara McCorriston
Are.

18:03.49
charukaarora
Um, yes.

18:08.88
Jason Chen
Within our own art form and how we um, ah how our aesthetic has maintained and change over time.

18:17.25
charukaarora
That’s very you true and I think also um, what I see I was just seeing Sadas chew on the website also and I I think sometimes you feel like you feel that. The kind of work that you’ve also shown it. It also shows a lot more openness and experimentation that I think you as artists whose build a space. Um, it reflects in your intellect I think it it just reflects in the ways that you do business.

18:46.49
Sara McCorriston
That’s good to hear I think that we I mean I think that the encouraging installation and exploration is it like definitely taps into our creative side in our way that we curate with artists.

18:58.38
charukaarora
Okay, tell me something how go ahead, go at this and go ahead.

19:03.30
Jason Chen
Yeah I mean I I would say I I don’t know like this is how Sarah worked with her um her expertise because like ah when I cure it. I have to separate myself as an artist to really do the curation because they are like you know as an artist I have a separate ego for how I look at artwork and and and such so like I have a different standard for for doing that. But as ah as a curator.

19:27.95
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

19:38.30
Jason Chen
I’m looking at um artwork through the lens of how does this fit into paradigm as like our aesthetic and and um does it fit into our aesthetic you know so it’s It’s a very different. Um, it’s a different muscle that I’m I’m exercising. When it comes to curation and and actually practicing my own own um art.

19:56.91
charukaarora
Um, it’s like 2 different canvases that you’re working on what about you? Sarah.

20:03.66
Jason Chen
Absolutely.

20:05.50
Sara McCorriston
Absolutely and I think that for I think for me with um the way. Well I don’t my fine art practice has really my creative practice I should say has really all gone into the gallery and I think that that’s. That’s one of the changes that’s happened on my end and kind of how Jason was saying the way we curate differently and part of that is because I I don’t have a separate um art practice really myself like when I make art. It’s typically just for me at this point in my life because I love running the business so much.

20:32.00
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

20:38.30
Sara McCorriston
And um so I think that that’s I I don’t feel like I have to create as much separation. It also makes it so that like I can talk to Jason and we can talk about curating his artwork and I can because it’s not easy to curate your own work and so Jason and I are able to have those conversations.

20:46.64
charukaarora
Um, yeah, absolutely.

20:56.45
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, because I’ve kind of separated myself from having a separate um, artistic practice myself. It’s really all goes into the gallery now for me.

21:06.13
charukaarora
That’s amazing tell me something what is paradigm to each of you today like like we spoken like it’s it’s taken its own shape. It’s independent of your individual identities and it’s been twelve and a half years which is not a small time I think it’s a pretty big time and long time. But something to survive this long and I think you’ve had immense support from the community. What what is paradigm and what what’s your vision for paradigm today.

21:27.27
Sara McCorriston
Are.

21:37.80
Sara McCorriston
Jason.

21:43.80
Jason Chen
Well um, oof usually I get to build on your answers. Um, but um, yeah, ah paradigm.

21:53.40
charukaarora
Um, good idea.

21:57.99
Jason Chen
Me to me. Um, first and foremost it’s a ah, it’s a family I I think that you know like it’s it’s going from just between Sarah and I you know building this this gallery space that.

22:01.88
charukaarora
Um.

22:14.50
Jason Chen
Really in the beginning I was really hoping to show more of my work and show more Sarah’s work but it kind of turned into a platform for artist friends that we know and. And thus how our families start growing as paradigm family and like artists that we have worked with since the beginning of paradigm we’re still working with them and and we our artists grow as we grow and besides that now we have different kinds of.

22:32.67
Sara McCorriston
Um, will.

22:48.76
Jason Chen
Support system like our friends all over the world that have worked with us that have curated with us. Um, we would you know see each other at art fairs and picked it pick up where we left off like a year or two ago and it’s it’s just feels like a great community to us.

23:00.43
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

23:08.80
Jason Chen
And um, in paradigm itself. It’s it’s like an inspiration for my for me and and for my my own practice because through curation I learn a little bit different things every time and I would try to. Maybe apply that to my own practice when I actually get to do the work and ah and I feel like that is you know, keeping me on my toe to be keeping up with ah like my my own practice keeping up with ah paradigms aesthetic and.

23:42.61
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

23:43.77
Jason Chen
And red or not I’m showing a paradigm I know my work is can can be better and better every time so that is that is what paradigm means to me right now, but it also means I’m seeing the future. It’s much bigger and and much. Ah.

23:52.88
Sara McCorriston
And here.

23:59.45
charukaarora
Are.

23:59.56
Jason Chen
Broader in in the sense of our connection through this to the city to the artists and to um to the art world technically.

24:05.40
charukaarora
I Love that and I completely get what you’re seeing how your work informs, Cool head etc.

24:07.12
Sara McCorriston
I.

24:14.17
Sara McCorriston
Yeah I um I I love everything you just said Jason I feel all of that so much I’m glad you went first? Ah, um, yeah I love yeah exactly I love that you talked about.

24:16.52
Jason Chen
A.

24:20.93
charukaarora
Now you get to build on that.

24:28.76
Jason Chen
If.

24:29.66
Sara McCorriston
Family because I do feel I do constantly feel like um wherever we go in the world. We have all these connections with people kind of wherever we go and it’s all through working together and art and but all these memories we’ve created with all these different people too And um.

24:48.82
Sara McCorriston
And and a lot of us have like been through some stuff together I mean even if if whether that’s life things or at that and because so often like art is so personal and so I can’t imagine working with all of the artists that we work with if we didn’t have these deep relationships with so many of them because you’re created like.

25:08.59
charukaarora
Absolutely.

25:08.69
Sara McCorriston
Art is is such a personal creation. So um, yeah, it’s so important that we have all these these connections with people around the world and the and the artists that we exhibit, especially the ones we’ve been working with for a long time and they’ve become some of our closest friends in our and our lives and um. And then the connection to the the business itself I like that Jason and I have constantly checked in with each other over the years about and sometimes have to answer like well what what What’s paradigm going to be in 5 years and and Jason and I are are. Like in in a good way. We’re constantly figuring out what the next steps are in our own lives and with our business and I think that the business wouldn’t have lasted as long as it had had. We not been willing to. Relook at what we’re doing relook at what we’re getting out of it. Do check-ins talk to each other about when we’re unhappy and talk to each other about when it’s a struggle and our roles in in the business because basically this entire time of running the business. It’s it’s. Been on and off growing pains because we do keep growing and um and it’s been It makes me really excited to move forward with the business because I think that um I think that we do we we do dream big. But I think that right now we do it with such a foundation.

26:16.64
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

26:36.21
Sara McCorriston
For the business and I think that um and like the community support that we have felt during the past few years has also been like especially ever since our 10 year anniversary and all the people that came out for that and then a few weeks later the pandemic hit and the support that we’ve received in the messages and.

26:50.80
charukaarora
Um, one.

26:55.82
Sara McCorriston
And these reminders that we that cause nines we’re just like 2 people working at 2 a m and like not even knowing if anyone’s noticing anything we’re doing and and um times you feel pretty alone in what you’re doing and then um and then people reach out and show so much love and talk about what.

27:08.93
charukaarora
Um, with you know.

27:15.15
Sara McCorriston
What you’re doing and what it means to them and then it’s like it’s also worth it and then you’re like okay I can I can get up and I can do it again and okay, anyone’s watching or anyone’s listening or anyone and and and I think that. I’ve personally realized how big and wide reaching our community is over the past year past three years maybe that more than I ever have. Um and that really excited to find out what’s next.

27:36.44
charukaarora
Yeah, no, and I think you know I remember with the galby space that happened and it was so heartwarming to see so many people on the internet in person you know. Shouting on the roof like you know, just making sure that everything felt personal like you could see the amount of effort people were making the amount how much it felt like it. It wouldn’t be a loss to you but it would be a loss to each one of us. How is what can you talk a little about a little bit about that because how did how has that fanned out the situation. Do you want to talk about that.

28:20.60
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, we were. We’re still kind of in it I would say it’s been a year and a half of us um, doing a little bit of soul searcharching and thinking about what’s next for Ah, what’s next for the business. Um, but.

28:21.81
charukaarora
Oh.

28:33.73
charukaarora
Um.

28:35.58
Sara McCorriston
We did we We did unfortunately get out bid for our building. However, so much support came through for us that like we just feel more support like so so supported so that like no matter what happens our community is going to be here for us.

28:53.90
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah.

28:54.23
Sara McCorriston
And that made it so that like we didn’t have to keep it all inside and that was such a huge help because it’s been now. Ah a year and a half of us. Okay, what is our long-term plan and us doing that soul searcharching and it’s actually opened up our eyes to what we want the business to be and made us reevaluate made us say.

29:13.14
charukaarora
Are.

29:14.70
Sara McCorriston
Well, well maybe we weren’t maybe we weren’t actually look like maybe maybe we should reevaluate What what those goals and and dreams are and now that we know that we have this So this support behind us no matter what we do next and so um, so we don’t you know we haven’t reached a conclusion yet. However, we feel so well equipped through from this learning experience to be able to make our next moves and it makes me more um, like confident and and more excited than I think I’ve ever been about this business and and and and it growing together because we know we have people like.

29:35.70
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

29:53.15
Sara McCorriston
In the hardest times we’ve ever experienced here to to lift us up and um and help us find find what’s next.

29:56.10
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

30:02.70
charukaarora
That’s true. What about you Jason what do you have to say about this.

30:11.19
Jason Chen
Well like Sarah said you know I definitely felt the love from our community and support from our friends and family. Um, and yeah, it’s you know we we see this as a little bit of hiccup. And we just have to keep going and move forward just like how we have been for the last twelve years you know, um, even for the from for the pandemic like through the the pandemic. We’re constantly reevaluating. We’re constantly reinventing ourself.

30:32.87
Sara McCorriston
Um, me.

30:33.51
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

30:35.18
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

30:47.38
Jason Chen
Ah, doing more things so that we are keeping our model you know, being making art accessible making art. You know that that is still affordable and and and be be able to be seen by many people so we have.

30:49.21
charukaarora
Access the word.

31:06.38
Jason Chen
Adapt in New New programs and and new ways of ah new equipments for our online services and stuff like that. So you know again, it’s it’s hard. It was heartbreaking when we find out that you know we got outbid it for.

31:18.32
Sara McCorriston
Are.

31:25.40
charukaarora
Yeah, yeah.

31:26.80
Jason Chen
Where we are but you know it’s it’s not the end of the world and and we Sarah and I have been through a lot of these kind of like tiny like at a time few was like life changing but then two years later we were like oh that was fine like we we adapted it.

31:34.28
charukaarora
Um, yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah I got that too.

31:39.66
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah, yeah.

31:44.21
Jason Chen
Figured it out. You know so we just have to keep keep um, keep doing doing what we do best and keeping Um, what? what’s the the core paradigm the core of paradigm as as long as we follow that and I feel like we can. We can.

31:54.50
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

31:58.20
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

32:03.18
Jason Chen
Make it speak cut and a lot of it because of the the people that our audience believe what we do and show the support that we need it.

32:10.17
Sara McCorriston
And we know that whenever we have oh yeah, we we know that whenever we do have like next steps to share with everyone I like every time I I talk to different people. They say how is it going have you figured out what you’re doing and you know it’s like I feel like we’re getting closer and I feel like and.

32:11.46
charukaarora
Um, yeah, and I think you know go it good.

32:30.11
Sara McCorriston
But like we wouldn’t be able to do this with all all without all the support that we have behind us and all the people kind of constantly checking in on us and um, yeah, we just I feel like we’re able to accomplish so much more knowing we have all that support behind us and that when we when we do have a plant like when we do. Form a new plan and we do have hopefully good news to share after all all this hard work and after we had to kind of pivot. Um, that will have this whole community behind us.

32:58.87
charukaarora
No, and also you know I think as a business owner as you know it’s It’s just amazing to know that no matter what because I think as business. We’re always coming up with you know hiccups and at that moment it feels like oh my goodness. Ah you know.

33:13.67
Sara McCorriston
Um, again.

33:14.84
charukaarora
What do I do now and then once you get through it and and you feel like okay oh it wasn’t such a big deal. But at that point when you’re going through it. It feels like that. But just the thought of knowing that even if it’s a hiccup but when you know that the people that you’re doing this for when you have them by your side I think it makes. Ah, huge difference because you don’t feel I think entrepreneurship and that I’m I’m really interested in asking this question I truly feel like art being an artist and being an entrepreneur are 2 very similar experiences I know I experience both of them and I know you too and why I say this is because as I feel.

33:49.12
Sara McCorriston
Um.

33:52.94
charukaarora
Like you both are working as partners but like let’s say for me I Um I run as 2 hearts as a founder alone but I have an amazing team. But even then it’s a very very lonely process and similarly being an artist is also a lot of solitary work. So I’m really interested in knowing that. How how does it work for you. Do you guys? Um, do you guys think of your roles as artists and then as creative entrepreneurs as business owners. How do they align for you.

34:25.49
Sara McCorriston
I think it’s combined for me and a bit separated for different parts of Jason’s life I think I don’t want to put words in your mouth Jason um, but I think that like I’ve put all of my creativity into and and I like a good challenge and. And so constantly coming up with new ideas and new initiatives and new just I’m always looking for a new challenge that can expand or grow or further level up the business and um, and for me I actually think that I realized that I that I could transfer. All of my creative energy into that like the beginning of the pandemic was a really good example because I like we had just planned these all these events for our 10 year anniversary right before the pandemic and that was a whole that felt like a whole.

35:18.63
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

35:19.99
Sara McCorriston
Cool like project management slash creative endeavor and brought so they brought 10 years of paradigm in our history together and then like two weeks later I felt like the rug was pulled out from under us. Yeah, and um, and so you know I feel like I gave myself.

35:30.95
charukaarora
Um, everything.

35:37.24
Sara McCorriston
Gave myself like a day or 2 to just breathe and take in okay, well ah you know, get groceries, get toilet paper. Um yeah I gave myself a couple days to do that. But after that I was I was like on the phone with our Pr team. Okay, well, everyone’s going to have to adapt to this. How are we going to do it. But.

35:43.58
charukaarora
A.

35:57.55
Sara McCorriston
For everyone else I need a 360 degree camera like every that look what they use in real estate. We’re gonna set that up. We’re gonna um, we’re gonna set up all this online programming. Thank you, thank you so much and we because we realized.

36:05.10
charukaarora
I Love what you did with that though.

36:15.10
Sara McCorriston
Everyone’s going to have to adapt and whoever does it. The fastest is is is going to get noticed and and there was also this opportunity that um, we’re a smaller gallery mostly run by Jason and I and we have 2 wonderful employees as well. But you know for the whole context of um.

36:16.14
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

36:33.80
Sara McCorriston
Our existence. Um, you know we we’re a small space where I we’re really, ah, we’re a small team and um and it was this opportunity where the playing field actually kind of got leveled a little bit because there are all these galleries that are.

36:35.87
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

36:51.65
Sara McCorriston
So much bigger than us all around the world and all of a sudden like all everyone had to work with was the internet and we were so well equipped to talk about ourselves to show artwork that way and I and I took your question into this whole other direction but it all tapped into like then I feel.

36:57.80
charukaarora
Um, yes, yes.

37:05.40
charukaarora
No, it sounds great.

37:09.35
Sara McCorriston
Feel like I got so creative like I felt like it really tapped I felt more creative than I had in years because it was just oh like everything was just leveled out in a way sky’s the limit for how we can stand out and use this really tough time um to further ourselves to.

37:16.96
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

37:23.50
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

37:29.34
Sara McCorriston
To keep keep our artists getting paid and and all of that and um, so the business has It’s really for me, It’s blent to go back to your original question for me I Definitely think that I have always been a creative person and I wasn’t quite sure where I was going to put all of that energy.

37:47.29
charukaarora
Made that.

37:47.37
Sara McCorriston
And running a business for me ended up and obviously curating an art advisory and the design aspect of that ended up being where all my creative energy went so it’s kind of all trolled together for me. Yes, 100%

37:57.42
charukaarora
It became one package for you? Yeah yes, but you know what?? what? you’ve said I Really think I really resonate with that and it didn’t come to me before like just before you said that something that I also resonate with the idea that with Covid. How even like how hard it was. It was also like I as ah as as someone who was running this business as even as an artist I felt um, more creative and also at part because to be honest, like in pre Covid times like you know getting into circles and getting into spaces. Um. Putting your work in spaces where all other artists or business owners or like um had access to it was really hard with Covid I Felt like everybody came on on brown zero and then it was just how you build on it and it felt fair.

38:55.63
charukaarora
And it gave a lot of chances to people like like us.

38:57.71
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah, yeah I agree. Absolutely.

39:02.15
charukaarora
Um, what about you Jason what do you think about this.

39:09.13
Jason Chen
I have to say I have to say it’s a little different for me because like I said I like what Sarah I mentioned like I I don’t um because my our rows are very different. Um I often tell people Sarah that’s what she does. And she allowed me to do what I do for the pet for paradigm. Um, but it’s it’s kind of true though in a way because I looked at Sarah as a leader that she makes decision that I will support. You know like she has a brilliant brain and.

39:42.35
Sara McCorriston
Thank you.

39:44.87
Jason Chen
Ideas that that need a support and I feel like if I was able to do that for her is able like we able to make these work and I can’t say as much that I ah I have to set like I said earlier I have to separate myself. Um, ah for for what I do for paradigm because a lot of it is very technical. It’s It’s not so much of like um I don’t really get to be super. Ah um, artistic with it. Um, you know when my own work I get to. Experiment I get to do whatever I want I I need to get to a place where I’m satisfied with with my work but with paradigm a lot of it has standards like you know the photograph has to be clean, um, all of the the ah artwork has to be photographed a certain way and. A lot of like different shots needed to be done So like there’s a standards for what I do for Paradigm. It’s it’s again, it’s very technical. Um, so in in a way. Um I don’t really feel like an artist when I’m.

40:57.97
charukaarora
Um, okay yeah.

41:00.85
Jason Chen
Paradigm it’s more like I I know what I have to do and I have to figure out what I need need to do when Sarah has like a new project. We have to figure it out. You know like a lot of that is coming from like technical backgrounds that I have so um.

41:18.80
charukaarora
Know it does no it does okay tell me something um before we we got into the call you were also talking about Jason we were just speaking about how um like I grew up in India and I didn’t have.

41:18.81
Jason Chen
Yeah, so I hope that answers your question. Ah I already kind of.

41:35.57
charukaarora
Gallery influence or um I was in a small town you were born in Chinaar was born in the Us. So I’m assuming Sara you were still and you anywhere in Philly around New York in Philly so you were still familiar with. Let’s say the art scene with artwood and us I feel like I still way more advanced. What was your experience with.

41:49.44
Sara McCorriston
And then.

41:56.24
charukaarora
Being like evolving as an artist than being into business and how did you grow up um, seeing art and now being immersed in art in both aspects being an artist and being um, a business owner of a gallery space.

42:15.10
charukaarora
Um, yes, yes.

42:19.27
Jason Chen
Sorry is that is that a question for me. Oh um, yes so um I I definitely feel that when I was in China art was really not not really in my radar at all because. A lot of me growing up is very academic like you know I have to go I have to go to school and like eight o’clock in the morning but then doesn’t get out until like 5 um and then the rest of my nights are usually yeah, usually like for homework.

42:45.88
charukaarora
Goodness.

42:53.83
Jason Chen
Or practice for like other things I’m never really good at I was never really good at academics. So um, the very slight experience experience I had was that I was with a group of ah younger kids.

42:54.74
charukaarora
Are.

43:13.48
Jason Chen
Um, that are takingck like very rudimentary drawing classes and and um ah watercolor painting. It’s like you know as a ah ah um, ah relaxation that ah I get to do and you know and and I find it fascinating and um. And at a time it was also just like oh those are the times I don’t have to do homework I get to like actually play and that’s what what art is to me at a time like it’s it’s play and most of the art that I’ve seen are like from movies Tv and like um like animation.

43:36.32
charukaarora
Um.

43:50.64
Jason Chen
So I was fascinated by an animation from a very young age and still are very fascinated by admission. So when I got to the us I don’t speak the language I barely able to talk to anyone or understand anyone.

43:53.27
charukaarora
Stick again.

44:08.72
Jason Chen
And so I kind of turned into ah I turned to art as a form of me spending time by myself. But also as a way of communicating in a way that like I get to show my friends Some of the drawings I made.

44:28.14
Jason Chen
And and you know and and such and I I get to take art classes in high school. Thank God There’s still art program. Um, and then the reason why I went to an art college is really really heavily because of the art teacher that I had.

44:33.39
charukaarora
I think.

44:33.87
Sara McCorriston
That.

44:46.40
Jason Chen
And high school. She really? um, encouraged me to find myself in in art and really push me to go to University Arts apply for it because she thinks that this is the only thing that I am. Interested In. You know, like a lot of time. Yeah, you know Asian Asian Households they they they don’t really see art as like a viable option for career. Um right? But then my my art teacher really pushed me to do that and and was.

45:10.38
charukaarora
Um, yes I know so hundred percent

45:24.86
Jason Chen
Ah, and I was present surprise surprised how how much I enjoy my um my college life and and whatnot and you know and the friends that I made along the way like Sarah and um I also have a different business that does animation. And all of those are actually people that I met from from from college and you know my life would be very different if I didn’t go to art college.

45:49.66
charukaarora
Oh wow now I completely relate to this because I feel like um I grew up in India and honestly like I for a very long time didn’t even like didn’t even know an artist like didn’t even know how of being an. Ah, my far fetch dream was being a fashion designer. So I don’t know if um, the Sarah I’ve also been I studied actually fashion and then I mean fashion designer was the far fetchtch idea for me even that felt like oh my god you know? um. Like it was like this is it was a very unreal impractical choice. Um, and you know as growing in a patriarchal setup. It’s like okay ultimately as a woman you know you you so kids and okay maybe you’ll just be a good bye for like you know it’s not like it’s not a career.

46:41.60
charukaarora
So definitely like it feels like it was a big leave. What about you? Sarah.

46:46.42
Sara McCorriston
I would I definitely feel lucky that I had a lot of exposure to the arts growing up I came from like a very it’s called the town I grew up right? by is called new hope and it’s it’s just outside the city of Philadelphia. And um, it’s a very artistic town and so I especially when it comes to performing arts and um, and and so I feel really lucky that I was surround I was definitely surrounded.

47:10.29
charukaarora
Um, oh well.

47:22.39
Sara McCorriston
By performing art and music and um I I did not view it as something that you did for a career. Um, but I was very exposed to the existence fine art was not really something that I had a lot of exposure to. Not not to like a huge extent at least but the arts in general I definitely have um, a lot of exposure to um my my dad’s um, like an ah a car insurance agent my my mom is ah a preschool teacher and. And um, what you know 2 jobs that are just like they don’t you don’t need like ah it’s like they’re and they’re both really good at it. But you know the two two jobs that like don’t really need an explanation aren’t really like complicated for someone to understand and um and I do I do remember when I started applying to colleges initially i.

48:10.60
charukaarora
Um, yes, yes.

48:19.64
Sara McCorriston
I I Really like math which is good because a lot you know, ah bookkeeping and accounting necessary. Um, but I really originally kind of thought I was going to be an engineer and it wasn’t until like towards the very end of my high school years and I and from I think when I was.

48:23.25
charukaarora
Um, oh my goodness. Um.

48:30.47
Jason Chen
Have.

48:35.63
Sara McCorriston
14 or 15 is when I started working at a hair salon and that was my like after school job that definitely taps into creativity for sure. Um, but when I started applying to colleges I didn’t even tell my parents where I was applying at first because I just didn’t know how they’d. They’d feel about it and they were asking me and I don’t worry about it I’m applying to colleges. Ah, you don’t need to worry about it. Ah like I’ve I had very much had that attitude. Um I’m going to college. Don’t worry I’m going to college kind of thing but don’t ask too many questions and.

49:04.00
charukaarora
Um.

49:13.30
Sara McCorriston
Um, so it was just very very much like I wasn’t prepared for anyone to understand um and but I also do feel like when I chose theater design at least coming from a family that like would go to community theater shows at least there was like a relation there. And that when um Jason and I were starting an art gallery but we both had full time jobs my full time job at that point in time was in fashion and um in technical design so like pattern making and all of that. Um.

49:43.14
charukaarora
No goodness.

49:47.91
Sara McCorriston
That you know it was just very much like a hobby like what we were doing at paradigm was a hobby and I feel like I’ve I’ve kind of eased the people around me into saying well actually like we’re making money. Actually I think I’m going to quit my job actually like like. Slowly over the years I feel like Jason and I have done similar versions of that. It’s um, ah, ah, easing ah easing the people that have been with us since childhood since our births in the idea of um.

50:04.21
charukaarora
Um.

50:15.69
charukaarora
Um, yes.

50:20.48
Sara McCorriston
But and and then and then making sure to say well well we we pay artists and they’ve been able to quit their jobs too. We pay ourselves now and and all of this and kind of I feel like I’ve done a lot of expressing it like that. Ah it which is like um yeah, so that’s but but I.

50:31.92
charukaarora
Um, allow he.

50:38.00
Sara McCorriston
I Will I will say my family at this point in time I I do feel like they they get it and that they’re very supportive of it and um, and yeah, but it just I felt like I kind of eased everyone into it. Ah.

50:44.61
charukaarora
Um, they do.

50:49.70
charukaarora
I I’m going to I’m going to take this strategy. What about you ideas into your dear friends and family especially in chinanon of course things have changed now. But your role as an artist and then also being a gallery you know, do people understand like. This comes to me a lot of times like people keep asking me what do you really? do and I’m like I really can’t tell you in 1 word now because I don’t have 1 job. What about you.

51:21.00
Jason Chen
Well ah, friends that I have from China like I kind of lost connection with them. But from time to time I did get to catch up and they were like so what are you doing now I was like well and then the next 30 minute would be me explaining they were like oh.

51:30.75
charukaarora
Um.

51:35.26
charukaarora
I I do.

51:38.36
Jason Chen
Okay, kind of cool that. So so yeah, so like just oh so you you you takeck you take photos for magazines like no, no, no, no, no, but okay, yes, sure that it’s It’s yeah, similar similar? Ah, but for my yeah, but for my for my um for my family it.

51:47.47
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah, that do.

51:47.80
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah.

51:56.14
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yes, yes, yes.

51:57.50
Jason Chen
they they I don’t think they do understand but they so they’re supportive in a way that’s like oh you’ve been doing this for 12 years and used they haven’t quit yet. So I guess cool and and and and recently my my mom have like call me be like.

52:04.87
Sara McCorriston
Ah, yeah.

52:14.79
Jason Chen
Oh I got your your your your your newsletter from Paradigm and this stuff looks really good I’m like there you go you get it now. That’s cool. So what is that? yeah.

52:16.40
Sara McCorriston
Oh my.

52:16.48
charukaarora
Um, wow.

52:18.84
charukaarora
Um I Love this I Love the biggest exactly Yes, my my parents are my mom. My mom was very creative and she like for a very long time. She didn’t understand that what I was doing and honestly I also didn’t understand but I was doing it I was also figuring it out.

52:34.40
Jason Chen
E.

52:39.30
charukaarora
So even I would I was like before I confuse them let me figure it out. What I really am doing and even then she was very supportive and she and she had a dream to be a creative like she was amazingly like she she was fashion and creative like she was she was outstanding and she even. Then she would be like shopping like shouting on top of a roof like you know oh this is what my daughter is doing and even today like my my father now like he doesn’t understand my family still doesn’t understand because in India it’s still. It’s still a very developing concept of you know, being an artist like working artist or having. Having an art business and like you know it’s still very different and they keep telling me like they keep asking me what do you really do and they’re like um at least you’re paying your bills and you’re living on your own that means you’re still making some sense.

53:19.63
Sara McCorriston
Are.

53:34.30
charukaarora
But they still don’t understand what exactly goes into it and one day they see me on a podcast the other they they see me in a studio working on my own work. They thought they they see me like in a project and they’re like do you really have a job or you just you know that’s and that’s really hard.

53:36.52
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah.

53:45.50
Sara McCorriston
I think.

53:51.75
charukaarora
Explain I think as creatives. It’s so hard to explain that there’s no 1 job role every day becomes a new project and sometimes projects like you know.

53:55.80
Sara McCorriston
Um, okay.

54:01.84
Sara McCorriston
I Think that all yeah yeah.

54:04.26
Jason Chen
Right? It’s it’s like starting over almost every project that you know you you learn something from your last project but you’re still trying to figure something out new almost every time you know that that come up like you know twelve years later we don’t know we’re gonna we’re gonna screw.

54:17.94
charukaarora
Yeah, yeah.

54:20.20
Sara McCorriston
Um, how we figured it out.

54:23.76
Jason Chen
Astrot Turve on our wall but we figured it out you know and like I’ve never made a a pedestal before but I did it so you know again, it’s it’s all about like I think that’s part about being creative is that we we are problem solvers like we we we we look at different ways and we try.

54:31.00
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah.

54:36.70
Sara McCorriston
Are you.

54:38.39
charukaarora
Um, yeah, um.

54:43.42
Jason Chen
Things too and use our skill to improve it and do better and then next thing you know you’re doing something completely new.

54:49.66
charukaarora
Um, yeah, and I also I think it yeah go ahead.

54:52.13
Sara McCorriston
I Think that like as far as um I think as far as our schedule in life too. I think that that’s that’s something that like I’m forever explaining to people not in the arts of of people like. Understanding when we’re at work and when we’re available and I’m like well that quest that changes every single day. Um, so you know and and and like and and I feel like sometimes that that’s been an interesting conversation I think ongoing with my family that like well there aren’t.

55:11.38
charukaarora
Um, yes.

55:23.91
Sara McCorriston
I create my own set work hours but like well how many days a week. Do you work I’m like well like 7 but I do try to make time where I’m not working too and I feel like it like the the fluid work schedule I think has also been something that’s like very hard to describe to someone that’s.

55:29.38
charukaarora
I.

55:42.81
Sara McCorriston
Um, not a creative and and the combination of not a creative and not in our generation because I think also even if you’re not a creative So many people are just freelancers in general so you know whether in in the gig economy as as we see it now. So um, that’s that’s been another thing that’s like.

55:49.21
charukaarora
Um, yes.

56:00.63
Sara McCorriston
You know I like learning how to communicate when when I’m at work and when I’m not.

56:01.53
charukaarora
Yes, yeah, and I think also something that biggest. It’s not like a fixed 9 to 5 or like you know when you have a specific space I think like you know we like for me at least I know. If I’m recording a podcast I have a very different mindset of a space I want to be in if I’m making the work if you know I want to be in a studio at home or if I have like something else that I need to meet someone like or a lot of times I prefer to work at home because anything can be done at home as well. But a lot of times people don’t understand that even if you’re doing nothing or even you’re just doing research or even if you’re you’re still working like even setting boundaries in that context is very very hard but has that been something to you.

56:33.46
Sara McCorriston
Um.

56:41.20
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, thankfully I think both of our partners under so understand at least they they both understand and also both remind us to not be working sometimes but. Um, we have we both have partners that understand passions and creativity and so are as far as like Jason’s wife definitely understands my partner definitely understands and.

57:01.42
charukaarora
Um, you.

57:13.40
Sara McCorriston
And so I think as far as like our home life goes I do feel like there is an understanding and then always a conversation of okay but you can’t be at work 100% of the time. Um, which is good like it’s good to have someone in your life say that to you? um.

57:25.59
charukaarora
Um, yes, are.

57:29.79
Sara McCorriston
You know because we each like love our partners so much and do want to make sure that we set aside time for them and have dinner together like things like like meals are very important to Jason and I like in general in life and so like it’s really important to me that I eat with my partner like that’s the.

57:44.66
charukaarora
Okay.

57:46.87
Sara McCorriston
That we take a pause and and Jason and I both like cooking and so like it’s put. It’s important to both of us that like to that we make sure to do that. That’s kind of like sanity. Um, so as far as at home. There’s that but I will say that um, if i. Depending on who I’m with or like the the ah that the people I’m with or if someone or even if it’s something or know. So so simple as as like it’s really easy for it to not seem like I’m at work when I am at work or I think that’s like another way to relate that is.

58:16.43
charukaarora
Um, yes.

58:20.65
Sara McCorriston
When we’re at the gallery and we’re throwing an event like we have to remind like sometimes I feel like I have to remind people a little bit that like no, no no I’m not like an attendee of this event I am running it So like the way you navigate conversations. Um and and like you know our friends come out so we do get to hang out with our friends.

58:21.24
charukaarora
Um, yes, yes.

58:31.45
charukaarora
Um, yes, yes.

58:40.58
Sara McCorriston
But I also have to always say like I’m sorry if my eyes are darting I’m just making sure someone doesn’t need me right now or something like that like so I think that we’re We’re always looking for the balance of um, you know I think where a lot of times we’re in places where people are going with their free time.

58:58.21
charukaarora
Um, yes.

58:58.26
Sara McCorriston
People go to galleries in their free times. Go to gallery events go to art fairs. All these things and and we’re at work.

59:05.75
charukaarora
I love that I think I completely agree to that I might that’s so amazing guys. Thank you so much for your time I really enjoyed this conversation but I have 1 last thing before I let you go I know we’re we’re stressed on time. So I have a happy fire that I want you both to.

59:23.70
Sara McCorriston
Um, okay, who’s first or are we the same time.

59:25.41
charukaarora
Race are for So are you ready.

59:31.45
charukaarora
Um, you know no I’ll ask question both of you answer that would be fun. Okay, so okay, so who wants to build on whom who’s going first.

59:34.12
Jason Chen
Would you just scream on top of each other.

59:38.51
Sara McCorriston
Ah, okay, we’re ready.

59:48.61
charukaarora
A.

59:49.87
Sara McCorriston
Um, well who.

59:50.35
Jason Chen
I Sure I’ll go first you.

59:50.46
charukaarora
Um, okay so when I ask the question Jason you answer first and then Sarah you go next? Okay, so one 2 3 here we go. Okay Jason 1 thing you want to convey through your work in the arts.

59:57.56
Sara McCorriston
Okay.

01:00:09.16
charukaarora
1 thing you want to convey through your work in the arts.

01:00:11.97
Jason Chen
I’m sorry can you repeat that question.

01:00:17.76
charukaarora
Um, okay, love that actually makes sense. Yes, sir.

01:00:19.27
Jason Chen
Time.

01:00:24.21
Sara McCorriston
Um, ah, um, community.

01:00:33.67
charukaarora
Love that? Yes, okay, if you could um sorry what’s that 1 word that describes you the best.

01:00:44.82
Jason Chen
Weird.

01:00:47.00
Sara McCorriston
Oh man does that mean I have to choose a different one. Ah, ah yeah, weird I’m going to go weird. Yeah, let’s be weird together.

01:00:51.83
Jason Chen
No, you don’t have to you’re gonna do the same one. We can be weird together.

01:00:59.63
charukaarora
Um, okay if you could have a gallery or your studio in any part of the world where would it be.

01:01:10.25
Jason Chen
We already have it. It’s in Philadelphia.

01:01:12.18
Sara McCorriston
Um, a.

01:01:13.27
charukaarora
Um, what if I do said.

01:01:16.40
Sara McCorriston
Um I could give an answer for my second choice because I completely agree with Jason’s statement our community is here but I know my second choice would definitely be or my two second choices I would be Mexico City and Tokyo.

01:01:30.22
charukaarora
Um, oh Wow Oh wow.

01:01:32.82
Jason Chen
yes yes I will also be okay with those 2

01:01:33.19
Sara McCorriston
But we can have we don’t have to give up Philadelphia for that. You know we could just add on. Yeah yeah.

01:01:37.10
charukaarora
Ah, yes, absolutely. And yes, yes, I’m sure that’ll happen. Yeah, and then more and then maybe somewhere another beautiful exotic space. Okay.

01:01:40.90
Jason Chen
Yeah, we can we can. We can have someone run it. It’s fine. Well we’ll be at either Tokyo or Mexico. Yeah.

01:01:54.60
charukaarora
Yeah, biggest source of inspiration.

01:01:56.70
Sara McCorriston
Um.

01:02:03.21
Jason Chen
Oh boy Um I have several actually so definitely from animation from film. Um, and honestly this this sounds like a art.

01:02:06.61
charukaarora
Um, anything will do.

01:02:20.70
Jason Chen
Ah, art school answer but Vincent Van go but yeah I really like Vincent Engel

01:02:21.31
charukaarora
Um, oh oh yes, no it makes sense. Why about you sir.

01:02:28.75
Sara McCorriston
Um, I know I know I’m a bit repeating my answer but recently in my creative life I have been most inspired by our community like it’s really just like that’s like been my driving creative force. But.

01:02:44.64
charukaarora
Sealand.

01:02:46.69
Sara McCorriston
Um, but it. But if if we’re talking like um artists that have inspired us us the most um ah Beus I aon and um Nick Cave are definitely 2 huge influences.

01:02:58.90
charukaarora
Not that that that okay, who’s your go to person when you’re in trouble or in need of advice.

01:03:10.91
Jason Chen
Sarah.

01:03:12.68
Sara McCorriston
Um, Jason and we have to call out. Yeah I know we have to call out also um Ginger Rudolph is and she was one of the people I would highly recommend for your podcast.

01:03:13.40
charukaarora
Um, that this this is like a group answering. But.

01:03:24.52
Jason Chen
Yes.

01:03:27.92
Sara McCorriston
Ginger Rudolph is the third part of us we have um like a mural company haha by paradigm with her and I would say if I’m not going to Jason for advice I’m going to ginger for advice and it really just depends on. Um, you know where where it sometimes it’s whoever is closest to me.

01:03:28.39
charukaarora
Um, Rari.

01:03:44.90
Sara McCorriston
And sometimes it’s the subject matter sometimes you know, but um, yeah, Ginger would would be the second person in my life then I need advice. Yeah yeah.

01:03:50.95
charukaarora
Let’s get her on the podcast then okay I’m interested in this man tell me each one a few and this you won’t repeat. Okay, we we have a condition on this man. So um, this is more than 1 rapid fire question. Um, as. And you could choose to answer days in sarabo as an artist soul as as a business owner now. But um, can you share 1 moment like um one moment that you really feel special. Um that you still celebrate and see till today. That’s very close to your heart and you feel very grateful for doing the work that you’re doing today I think experience in moments that we experience sometimes that feel very special and you know give you a sense of this completeness of why you are on this path. Jason is really like. Pushed himself as he’s looking.

01:04:45.65
Jason Chen
Um, I you know that it’s it’s the Adhd in me that I often forget about things but um I really.

01:04:51.91
charukaarora
Um, no, you can take your time we are here.

01:05:02.33
Jason Chen
It’s it’s the I really want to say it’s the the time where the times that we actually get to sit together with like with Sarah with um, her partner Langston our friends that have you know it’s not. It’s not.

01:05:16.51
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

01:05:20.62
Jason Chen
In the gallery. But it’s usually outside of a gallery when we are just being ourself just channing between us having a good time often at Sarah’s backyard you know having a drink having dinner just like those are a time that i.

01:05:27.87
charukaarora
I think.

01:05:29.37
Sara McCorriston
Um, he.

01:05:34.42
charukaarora
You see.

01:05:39.82
Jason Chen
Cherish and it’s I don’t think this is gonna this would happen if we didn’t start paradigm twelve years ago

01:05:42.59
charukaarora
Um, yeah, and all sudden. Yeah.

01:05:42.77
Sara McCorriston
Yeah, that’s a really good. That’s a really good answer I Definitely I feel that and and I I would say that like I’ve really thought about I I don’t know what I forget What made me think about it but I was like really thinking about the question of like what’s my greatest weakness.

01:05:58.56
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

01:06:02.23
Sara McCorriston
And I’ve come to the conclusion that my greatest weakness is not taking the time to soak in the things we’ve just done or the things we’ve just accomplished not not taking the time to reflect on it being like cool, checked it off the list even if we accomplish something incredible. But I just have this tendency to like okay done moving on. No time to think about it and um, what Jason’s talking about are those moments where we’ve taken the time to reflect on it and and to reflect and like actually taking a moment of relaxation with the people that we’ve accomplished really great things with.

01:06:24.24
charukaarora
What’s next.

01:06:40.87
Sara McCorriston
And um, those end up being those those moments and it’s something that I’m trying to strengthen myself personally that I’m trying to like I think it’s good to think about what your greatest weakness is and and and like what you can do to improve that and and and it’s definitely through what Jason’s talking about.

01:06:41.81
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

01:06:55.64
charukaarora
I love that. But also Jason do you think it’s also because you know you come from an immigrant like and it was like for me sometimes being here in India and having a global community running a creative business being an artist. Sometimes it’s like like you Sara said like I’m also a person who keeps like what’s next What’s next What’s next but also like when I take a moment and like truly do I get to do this or like like living a creative life or like painting yourself like I have I spend this time and I do this and I get. Live this life. It feels like like you know it feels surreal. It feels unreal that you’re sitting in this part of the world making a life as an after for you know.

01:07:46.30
Jason Chen
I Mean you know as as ah as an immigrant as like a person that I am I I do feel like I am constantly having to prove myself whether or not I could do this um rather or not as to the people that I know or.

01:07:52.36
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

01:08:03.48
Jason Chen
To myself. Honestly, um, and and and I often forget or overlook like what Sarah said that you know like the moments that I cherish the most are the people that are in my life that have supported us and became friend. Um. And that I actually get to spend the time with them. You know and like forget about art. Forget about the business for a second because like that’s secondary to me honestly throughout the the twelve years it’s the is the friends and the the people like like I said paradigm is a family to me.

01:08:30.96
charukaarora
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:08:40.60
Jason Chen
So all of the people that we have in our lives right now are most terrible to me.

01:08:42.38
Sara McCorriston
Absolutely.

01:08:42.67
charukaarora
I love that no that I think that’s why it shows in in everything you do I think you truly like you radiate that energy. Okay, if you were to meet younger Sara and Jason today.

01:08:57.66
Jason Chen
And.

01:09:00.58
charukaarora
What advice would you give her.

01:09:05.67
Sara McCorriston
I Don’t know I wouldn’t want to screw anything up right? You know I like I feel like all my mistakes led to us doing what we did right? So maybe like I maybe I maybe I don’t give any advice but.

01:09:11.53
Jason Chen
Ah.

01:09:11.86
charukaarora
Um I.

01:09:15.40
Jason Chen
Right.

01:09:22.82
Jason Chen
I would just say so I just say stick stick with Sarah she’s she’s a good. She’s a good egg.

01:09:30.48
charukaarora
Ah, this is an amazing advice. That’s a great advice. Actually what for both of you are okay.

01:09:32.71
Sara McCorriston
Yeah I like that I love that I love that? Yeah yeah, definitely yeah, no I obviously I met with Jason. Ah.

01:09:42.66
Jason Chen
Yes, stick with Sarah Sarah

01:09:45.12
charukaarora
Yes, okay shower to an artist or 2 that you’re currently loving on social media. Especially.

01:09:54.51
Sara McCorriston
Is it.

01:09:59.42
charukaarora
Um, shower to artist that you’re so loving specially on social media I Love this question.

01:10:00.45
Jason Chen
I’m sorry gay repeat that question.

01:10:09.30
Jason Chen
Oh man, ah 2 artists one I definitely se us David Stern he’s been a good influence and a good artist to watch for a very long time.

01:10:10.39
Sara McCorriston
Ah.

01:10:26.12
Jason Chen
Ah, the other one let me see I want to say a goodfriend of ours Alex Mmonlon because he’s he’s definitely an artist that I really appreciate and like seeing him grow.

01:10:34.60
charukaarora
Um, okay.

01:10:40.80
charukaarora
Um, yeah.

01:10:43.55
Jason Chen
As an artist and and a collaborator honestly. Um you know we’ve been working on something together for you know, good like 5 years and it’s always fun to see his work everything that every time I saw his feet I was like oh yes, awesome something new and like.

01:10:58.26
charukaarora
Oh love that I’m going to link both of them in the show nots what about you? Sarah.

01:11:00.90
Jason Chen
Ah, get me excited.

01:11:02.55
Sara McCorriston
Ah.

01:11:07.90
Sara McCorriston
Um, I would say an artist that I just I think I sent a video to Jason um, this week. Um India Rose Crawford is an artist that this week has been bringing me a lot of joy I think I probably have um.

01:11:16.43
charukaarora
Um, you.

01:11:23.22
Sara McCorriston
I Don’t want to credit the the wrong publication. But I’m guessing I discovered this artist because of colossal I’m checking my phone and making sure that I’m crediting um the the correct publication. Um, but yeah I.

01:11:30.18
charukaarora
Um, oh wow.

01:11:41.61
Sara McCorriston
Her animations have been just bringing me so much joy. Um, so much joy this week

01:11:44.00
charukaarora
I can’t wait to check out I wish link all of them in the show notes and make sure that we also follow them. Okay, last question, ask. Creative entrepreneurs artists yourself. What is that 1 piece of advice. You’d like to give to people who are listening to this episode looking forward 1 last thing before we close it.

01:12:15.72
Jason Chen
Um, definitely stay true to what you believed in and take your time honestly really take your time. Um, it took us 12 year to get here and we’re still going you know and it’s not.

01:12:32.69
Sara McCorriston
But yeah, but a sprint if not a sprint.

01:12:32.91
Jason Chen
It’s not a race. It’s a marathon you know a marathon is a race I’m sorry um, it’s not but it’s not a sprint. Um, so I think it’s um, anything that’s worth doing takes time and it’s like.

01:12:35.92
charukaarora
Um.

01:12:49.11
Jason Chen
It’s a good wine. You know like it takes time to ferment. It takes time to to appreciate to learn to appreciate and I think that is yeah, allow yourself time to do the things you need to do to get to where you need to get to because a day worth of work. A lot of the time doesn’t mean a whole lot but 10 years worth of work yet. That’s a portfolio.

01:13:10.89
charukaarora
Um, yeah, not that that’s a be advice Jason thank you.

01:13:11.42
Sara McCorriston
Um I I think for me, um I think that in this relates to what Jason was saying but that you know don’t don’t like make sure to keep. To keep relationships strong of of people that um, like have faith in you have patience with you. Want to see you grow like want to see you be your greatest self those those friends or family whoever they are in your life. Um, like. Ah, there is just no way we would have accomplished what we’ve accomplished so far and what I believe will accomplish in the future had we not been surrounded by people that believe we can do it and that are constantly by our side to tell us that that we can and that they that you know they’re they’re here to show us love and and give us support. And um, there’s just absolutely no way we could have done this like we could have created what we’ve created in a vacuum. So I think that like like it making sure to to um you know put into those relationships what they deserve.

01:14:20.77
charukaarora
I Love that and that absolutely like that’s a golden advice I think that something I feel like constantly even in spite of all the conversations that we’ve had in this episode the community and the love that you feel and that you’ve put into all the work that you do I think it’s a big one and.

01:14:38.79
Sara McCorriston
Is.

01:14:39.67
charukaarora
And it’s a test like I’m sitting here in India but I’ve and for it far I think so for the past two and half three years I’ve been following you and I think I have truly seen that with with just internet and I think it’s not that often that you know you experience that. So I think you’re doing a wonderful wonderful job and I really. I’m so glad that we had this conversation.

01:15:03.86
Sara McCorriston
Oh thank you so much. It’s really really good to hear that and um, we appreciate I think that you’re doing the same thing. You’re really building a community with what you do and and you’re really open in the way that you that you share and it’s really appreciated.

01:15:16.56
charukaarora
Thank you? Okay, 1 last thing where can people find you any your set. You know if they want to follow you your work the gallery any new project that you want to share with us feel free.

01:15:20.23
Jason Chen
Yeah, yeah.

01:15:23.70
Sara McCorriston
Um, yeah.

01:15:35.61
Sara McCorriston
So the gallery um is at paradigm gs so it’s like g for gallery s for studio so at paradigm gs and then um we mentioned we have a few different social media accounts. We mentioned Ginger Rudolph and ginger runs at haha x. Paradigm and we like refer to that as haha by paradigm but it’s hahax paradigm paradigm is parad I g m and um paradigm art advisory. Although those are 3 of our social media accounts and then I’ll let Jason say his personal 1.

01:15:53.49
charukaarora
Um, yes.

01:16:09.55
charukaarora
Um I will link all yes Jason.

01:16:12.85
Sara McCorriston
Thank you.

01:16:16.65
Jason Chen
I am going to plug wall paradigm for sure. But then you know my personal account that Chinese Kit N I Want to plug the ah new. Well a recently finished project.

01:16:20.18
charukaarora
Um, yes.

01:16:32.64
Jason Chen
Um, it’s ah it’s a documentary film that um I’ve worked with a local art art artists curating what do you call that Sarah yeah curate horo collective on a um.

01:16:41.16
Sara McCorriston
Curatorial Collective I Guess yeah.

01:16:43.37
charukaarora
Um, oh wow Sarah has like a.

01:16:49.14
charukaarora
Ah, yeah, I’m coming to you Sarah.

01:16:50.74
Jason Chen
Yeah, she knows she knows. That’s why at it like every time you don’t know anything just go this air. Um, so I have recently I’ve recently directed a documentary film. Um, ah. It’s it’s a short documentary It’s like a 20 minute thing so we will be having a premiere on the nineteenth of October at um, the navy yard central green navy yard. So um, people that can come great if not, we will make sure that we will have a a link. Um.

01:17:14.38
charukaarora
Are.

01:17:26.42
Jason Chen
Ah, uploaded. You know, ready to go and to share so also follow group x projects on Instagram to get all of the information for the documentary and all of the projects that they have done in the past fantastic work.

01:17:37.41
charukaarora
I I can’t wait to see why don’t you do something Jason why don’t you send us all of this and I want to make sure that we upload this on our fe site and you know even post when it goes live and you know.

01:17:37.73
Sara McCorriston
Jason gave me a sneak peek and it’s really good.

01:17:53.26
charukaarora
Help um, just share this with our own community and newsletters I think I we love that absolutely so you give me all the links we add everything Jason and Sarahra has mentioned in the show notes.

01:18:00.19
Jason Chen
Absolutely thank you so much.

01:18:08.70
charukaarora
Also share Jason’s project and I’m really excited to see that chinese kid now so we’ll have everything in the show notes. Thank you so much guys. It was very nice to speaking both of you.

01:18:16.29
Sara McCorriston
Great. Same to you? Thank you so much.

01:18:23.69
charukaarora
Thank you I’ll see you soon.

01:18:24.68
Jason Chen
Thank you for having us.

01:18:31.29
charukaarora
Okay.